Dr. Karl Menninger

The Douglas P. Cooper Distinguished Contemporaries Collection | Dec 31, 2015

In January, 1974, I flew from New York to Kansas City, Missouri with O'Brien and a cameraman to record discussions with three icons of America's heartland, each in his eighties: regionalist painter Thomas Hart Benton in KC, with Psychiatrist-Author Karl Menninger and 1936 Republican Nominee Alf Landon, both 65 miles west, in Topeka, Kansas.

The Interview

George O'Brien opened our free-form, "slice of life" talk by complimenting Dr. Menninger on the cordial way we'd been treated by various staff at The Menninger Clinic.

It's just a mirror Dr. Karl (as they called him) stated. It's a mirror because you're that kind of people. And also you didn't know my father, the most genial man.

Cooper told Dr. Karl that his clinic was the most often referred to on mental health issues.

But Dr. Karl would have none of the accolade, and told us he's still uneasy getting credit for what a lot of people have achieved.

Besides, he intoned, he had a different attitude about mental illness.  Let me tell you about Clifford Beers. Spent a lot of years in a mental health institution. He tried to popularize the concept that mental illness is curable. And remember, he added, that most people get well without any help from a doctor!

Now we've got our diagnostic center here at the Menninger Clinic. We want to help judges on sentencing. All they've got is the evidence of a few witnesses. Did anybody observe the person's home? Environment? Family? Role models. What kind of love was provided?

Then we test skills, schooling, intelligence. And all of this becomes a recommendation to the judge. And they usually follow it: going back to school, someone sensible to live with, focusing on where his talents lie.

Cooper recites that Dr. Karl has three new books out. But on that particular day, Dr. Karl was interested in the confluence of crime and mental health (discussed in his 1968 book, The Crime of Punishment). I'm concerned with sentencing and poor judges. And I want to denounce the jails as abominable and ineffectual.

Second, the judges know nothing about the arrested. I want to advise them; distinguish the wealthy vs. the poor, who are treated differently. They're bewildered, so they do what's stereotyped and rely on the statute books. Instead, I want to help judges to get people to change.

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The Douglas P. Cooper Distinguished Contemporaries Collection (1967-1974) contains rare interviews with influential writers, statesmen, artists, songwriters, journalists and others who have left their mark on our culture.

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