Streams

To the End of the Land

Friday, October 01, 2010

David Grossman discusses his novel To the End of the Land, and offers his reflections on the Israeli - Palestinian conflict.

Guests:

David Grossman

Comments [10]

jgarbuz
but Sharon /Rabin families came from east europe also. the nationalism ideas of 1850-1948 europe shaped most of israel's founding generation.

Oct. 01 2010 01:13 PM
jgarbuz

to hjs 11211

It depends on what you mean by "leaders." If you mean Prime Ministers, Sharon and Rabin were born in what was then called Mandatory Palestine. Netanyahu in Israel. Most of the rest were born in Eastern Europe or Russia. I agree that the Mizrachi and Sephardic Jewry was underrepresented in the first 50-60 years, mainly because most who came from the Muslim countries came with much lesser education levels. It takes a generation or two to level the education and economic gaps.
But there now have been a number of defense ministers and others who were born in Iran, Iraq, etc. There have even been Arab members of the Israeli Supreme Court.
It's all a function of time and education.

Oct. 01 2010 11:19 AM

jgarbuz
what % of israel's leaders came from europe (or america via europe?)
leaders make laws not people

Oct. 01 2010 11:04 AM
jgarbuz

To hjs 11211

First of all, 40% of Jewish Israelis are refugees from the Arab, Muslim or African countries. Only 60% are refugees from Europe. It's usually the Euro-Jews who are far more compromising vis a vis the Arabs than are the Mizrachi (Oriental) Jews. Mainly because the Mizrachi Jews left behind their own homes and properties in the Arab and Muslim countries, but their plight is never brought up in the popular press. For example, it is never mentioned that Sderot, for example, is made up mostly of 20,000 Jewish refugees from Muslim North Africa.

Oct. 01 2010 10:58 AM

ira
i don't think you could say "stole." the UN spilt the land in 2 and then the arabs in their dilution thought they could take the whole prize.
interestingly, if the arabs had taken what was offered they would have been better off.

jgarbuz
israel's oppression is well known. they, who grew up in early 20th century europe learned it well.

Oct. 01 2010 10:51 AM
jgarbuz

To Ira of Brooklyn

The Jews "stole" nothing. The League of Nations in 1922 ruled that every inch of Palestine (west of the Jordan river) was to be restored as the "Jewish National Home." Existing non-Jewish inhabitants were slated to become citizens of a Jewish homeland with full civil, religious and property rights.
But the Arabs refused to accept the ruling of the League of Nations and struggle between JEws and Arabs between 1921 and 1947 led to a UN vote that offered to partition the country into a Jewish state and an Arab state instead. But the Arabs rejected the compromise,went to war, lost, and this created TWO refugee situations: Arabs who fled or were expelled from Jewish controlled territory; and Jews who fled or were expelled from the Arab countries. But today there are many millions of Arab living in ISrael, the West Bank and Gaza, and hardly any Jews left in the Arab countries. The Jewish properties and lands in the Arab countries were truly stolen.

Oct. 01 2010 10:48 AM
Mike in CH

Brian, is Skype not a better way for such long distance communications?

Oct. 01 2010 10:41 AM
jgarbuz

If Jews only had the mentality of oppressors, the situation would have been solved long ago. Just as the problem of the "indians" was solved in the US long ago.
The problem of the Jews is that having been the oppressed for so long, they can't handle victory instead of victimhood.
And the world can't understand victorious victims. Christianity, which emanated from the Jewish homeland, taught to "turn the other cheek" and "love your enemies."
Unfortunately, little of that rubbed off on the Muslims and would-be Christians. The Jews are expected to love their enemies, but will the enemies ever love the Jew?

Oct. 01 2010 10:41 AM
Ira from Brooklyn

The Israelis stole (yes, "stole") Palestine from the Palestinians in 1948. No due process; no compensation; no apologies. They just stole it. Is there any wonder why the Palestinians are so pissed off?

Oct. 01 2010 10:39 AM
whoindatgarden from Brooklyn

Another one of those takes on an issue that is non resolvable with the current process in place.
In psychology they say the ones who have been oppressed become the opressor and we see that in the Palestinian Israeli conflict.
Why is it that every U.S administration or European leadership has only stuck to the two state solution.
Why is there no leadership to say there shall be a United States of Israel and Palestine.
Since there will never be a Truth commission held with true reconciliation, this saga will sustain itself and it benefits a few like hose who sell arms and those who live on writing numerous articles/policies and thrive on suffering to make a living.
I find that WNYC has not been able to bring bout any real changes and so it seems waste of precious air time.
What purpose do such things serve except to regurgitate the same stuff over and over again.

Oct. 01 2010 10:05 AM

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