Streams

On Dog Breed-Specific Legislation

Thursday, August 22, 2013

The White House has come out against laws that ban certain breeds of dogs, like the pit bull. Nancy Perry, senior vice president of ASPCA Government Relations, explains breed-specific legislation and what it means in our area, including in New York City public housing where 27 breeds are banned.

Guests:

Nancy Perry

The Morning Brief

Enter your email address and we’ll send you our top 5 stories every day, plus breaking news and weather.

Comments [68]

Mr. Bad from NYC

@ you're an idiot

Hey, Rube, what would be a credible source in your humble opinion....?

A pit bull breeder? You're a low life loser from AL. Go **** your sister, isn't that how you do it down there? Keeping the breed pure and so on? -1 for all the dumb insults against my impregnable phalanx of logic and common sense....

Sep. 18 2013 08:29 PM
you're an idiot

again, dogsbite.org is NOT a credible source. and if you have never been around an APBT then anything you say is not credible.

Sep. 09 2013 03:15 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

Can someone take out all the " " trash in this comment section? I'd appreciate it, thanks. In the meantime enjoy some truth from someone who isn't a deep south redneck who used to use black people for chew toys...

http://www.dogsbite.org/

Sep. 06 2013 07:14 PM
one more

since someone was citing dogsbite.org (ran by Mrs. Lynn) this is an example of just exactly how credible she is

http://legal.pblnn.com/pro-bsl-experts/dogbiteorg/109-collen-lynn-seattle-animal-control-records

have fun

Sep. 04 2013 02:01 PM
:)

http://www.aspca.org/pet-care/virtual-pet-behaviorist/dog-behavior/truth-about-pit-bulls

Aug. 29 2013 09:06 AM

good for Obama! I'm tired of the politically motivated, rich, fat and happy ASPCA and Human Society running amok with stray dogs on high drama commercials. The more mixed-breed shelter dogs are acquired by the public, the more puppy mills will flourish. Punish the human, not the dog....

Aug. 28 2013 06:48 AM

I listened to this broadcast today and I must say Nancy Perry, so called S.V.P. ASPCA Government Relations, lost all credibility with me with her "Laboratory" retrievers. Of course, the AKC is against "breed-specific" legislation; they are associated with the breeding BUSINESS.

What most people who fall in love with a puppy, don't realize: It is not easy to train a dog to live in a household and it costs a lot of money to keep them healthy and well. I know, I've been there many times and I've never purchased a dog. Banning certain dogs from city provided housing protects the dog as much as it does the occupants.

My first dog in NYC was a stray mutt an acquaintance found in upstate NY in the early 70s. My second I found running down Broadway near Wall Street a few years later. One of my latest two was rescued from the Bronx River at about a year and a half old - a mix of Maltese and something else and the final one is a year old AKC Irish Terrier that a pet store couldn't sell.

Aug. 27 2013 04:36 PM
ElPee from NY

Whether for or against breed specific legislation I'm just curious as to just how much research and thought the President engaged in before releasing his statement. If it encourages reasonable discussion, and hopefully solutions, that's a good thing I suppose.

For him, the most timely statement (that could have helped millions of animals - and many (many) pit bulls, for that matter) would have been the rescue of a homeless or shelter dog as their new addition.

At least I hope he puts in a plug for spaying/neutering a few months down the road...

Aug. 25 2013 04:13 PM
Sherri B from KC Metro Missouri

By the way, the old adage "guns don't kill people, people kill people"? A Gun can sit out in the open on a table for 100 years and harm no one by itself. However, should some idiot pick the gun up and pull the trigger, it could harm or kill someone. JMO per common sense and I support the NRA!!!! Vote Teddy Nugent for President!!!!!

Aug. 24 2013 07:26 PM
Sherri B from KC Metro Missouri

@ Dawn O'Keefe...you nailed it, sweetie. And not acknowledging the ignorant individuals who have never own a bully breed, not researched all sides of BSL...their opinion does not count.....

Aug. 24 2013 07:14 PM
Julie Wall

A must watch video if you want to understand the dog fighting culture. IMO, this is why the public has negative feelings about pit-bulls. When you say 'pit-bull' the general public thinks dog fighting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MA963En60fg&feature=player_embedded

Aug. 24 2013 11:18 AM
S.P.Q.R. from NYC

Myth #3: Human-aggressive pit bulls were "culled"

Historically, it is believed that dogfighters removed human-aggressive pit bulls from the gene pool. "Man biters," as dogmen referred them, were "culled" to prevent dog handlers from suffering vicious bites. However, dogmen themselves and pedigrees show a different story. As far back as 1909, George Armitage shares a story in, "Thirty Years with Fighting Dogs." He describes Caire's Rowdy as not a mere man-biter, but as a "man-eater," the most dangerous biter of all.6

In more modern years, a substantial number of champion (CH), grand champion (GR CH) and register of merit (ROM) fighting dogs carry the title of a man-biter or a man-eater. These pit bulls were championship-breeding stock, whose famed owners never for a moment considered culling the dogs. Some of the most well known dogs include: Adams' GR CH Zebo, Indian Bolio ROM, Garner's CH Chinaman ROM, Gambler's GR CH Virgil and West's CH Spade (man-eater).7

In 1974, after a series of high profile news articles written by Wayne King and published by the New York Times, the image of the ferocious fighting pit bull moved from the shadowy world of dogmen into the mainstream. This period, between 1975 and 1979, is known as the "leakage period" when the breeding of pit bulls drastically increased through gang members and drug dealers, who wanted the "toughest dog" on the block, as well as by pet pit bull breeders.8

While some dogmen of the past may have culled human-aggressive dogs to keep their stock free of man-biters, once the leakage period began, there is no evidence that similar selective pressures were maintained.9 As early as 1980, pit bull attacks begin headlining newspapers, "Another Pit Bull Attack Reported; Boy, 8 Slashed (1980)," as well as reports of pit bull owners trying to bolster the breed's "deteriorating" public image, "Pit Bull Attacks As Owners Fight Image (1980)."

Aug. 23 2013 04:21 PM
BillyGoat

Don't feed the trolls. Mr. Bad is a troll. Don't allow his insults to infuriate you.

Aug. 23 2013 03:59 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Dawn O'Keefe/Sherri B from Kc Metro Missouri et al

You can keep pushing that same line: "It's the owners not the dog" All day. I realize that this it is the gold standard in obfuscation for the Pit Bull lobby.

It won't work.

A lab or other popular breed may kill a person or child once in awhile. That does not prove your point. Pit Bulls area attacking and killing children and infants at epidemic levels. It's in their nature. They love to kill, they have been bred to do it for countless generations. People made them that way and you cannot unmake them with pointless, illogical appeals to your sick emotional attachment to these animals that kill and maim your family member and those of your neighbors at an alarming and ever increasing rate.

Pit Bulls are inherently dangerous animals. They are not suitable pets for anyone other than a highly trained and experienced dog handler. They need to be sterilized, taxed, licensed and insured out of existence. Maybe then we won't have to read stories like this in the news EVERY DAY:

http://www.bakersfieldcalifornian.com/local/x740580207/Pit-bulls-maul-two-people-in-Oildale

There is literally a news story almost EVERY DAY of the year describing a pit bull attack somewhere in this country.

You people are really sick. Did you know that A 1991 study found that 94% of attacks on children by pit bulls were unprovoked (and far more damaging and brutal), compared to 43% for other breeds? Read the study:

http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/88/1/55.abstract

Aug. 23 2013 02:49 PM
Dawn O'Keefe

All of this arguing, but it all boils down to one simple thing - everyone knows that ANY large dog is capable of hurting someone. Pit Bulls have a powerful psi in their bite, HOWEVER, a labrador can rip your throat out if it wants...stop kidding yourself if you think that only pits are the problem. it is bad owners, period. You have small children? The simple answer is to be a responsible parent/dog owner and take precautions to keep everyone safe. If it means not getting a large dog, then don't get a large dog. You can't get a large dog,have it bite your kid, then cry that the breed should be banned. Grow up, people, and take responsibility for a situation that we all created. If someone does not have their dog under control, then they should not own the dog. You cannot punish the good ones because some idiot acquired a dog that they cannot control.

Aug. 23 2013 01:08 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

Wow the Pit Bull lobby is out in full force on this board.

@ Sherri B from Kc Metro Missouri

You wrote:

"Now, regrettably...yes there were young children that lost their lives."

Oh, WOW, just WOW. Did a single tear fall from your cheek as you wrote that? In the end though you still stick to the company line, it's the owner, it's the owner... the same ridiculous and unsupportable line of BS every pro Pit Bull poster on this board has been pushing. It has as much weight as that old conservative canard "Guns don't kill people, people kill people"...

Some animals are too dangerous for people to keep as pets, they require too much training, too much specialized knowledge and the sort of constant attention that few pet owners if any can afford to give. People can't keep lions, bears or wolves as pets. The plague of Pit Bulls and their massacre of children and infants needs to be stopped. What can you say about an animal that attacks children, unprovoked, 90% or the time? It's a dangerous, vicious animal. It needs to be banned. Australia did it and the Maryland Supreme court has already declared that Pit Bulls are "inherently dangerous".

Wake up.

Aug. 23 2013 10:02 AM

Take your medicine and STFU you life piece of ignorant garbage. I don't have to justify anything to you. You can make cracks about my weight all you want to. I much prefer being fat, smart and considerate rather than an unhappy blazing asshole. Yeah, you ARE awake up call. I have now had my first conversation with someone dumber than a box of rocks.

Aug. 22 2013 10:53 PM
Sherri B from Kc Metro Missouri

Wow..I have read through most of the responses and I have come to this conclusion. It is best to be acknowledged of all dog breeds before you have an opinion. I have raised and trained dogs (different breeds) most of my life; in 40 plus years, I have been bitten once. This year in fact, and the breed of the dog? A black Lab.....I was surprised too. I did not provoke the dog nor was I near it's yard. But, the dog was running loose (no leash or tether) and it was very evident that it's owners had not worked with the dog enough for it to listen. Not to mention, the town I live in has a leash law!
The problem quite simply is bad dog owners. Most pups are born into this world looking to please and be man's best friend. If the pup is not nurtured once it is weaned and trained how to behave as a good dog...then, it's natural instincts will take effect. There is the bad element of certain "dog breeders" regardless of breed that train dogs to do unspeakable behaviors. Is this the dog's fault?...not really.
I lost my sweet 15 year old Border collie a year ago July; she was my 4-H training demo dog and the best dog I could have ever asked for. Very trainable, very smart and very lovable. I recently adopted and rescued a dog in May of this year. A Staffordshire Bull Terrier; she is smart, she is trainable and she loves us. And I volunteer with the rescue group I adopted my dog from.
By the way, there are 14 different types of dog breeds in the bully group. American Bulldog, Boston Terrier, Boxer, English Bulldog, Olde English Bulldogge, French Bulldog, Alapaha Blue Blood Bulldog, Valley Bulldog, American Pit Bull Terrier, American Staffordshire Terrier, Staffordshire Bull Terrier, Bull Terrier, Bull Mastiff, and the Banter Bulldogge. Most of them acknowledged by the American Kennel Association.
Now, regrettably...yes there were young children that lost their lives. It still comes down to the owner of the dog and the responsible adult over the child to make sure of safety. And it is not just the bully breed; over the years I have heard children mauled by Saint Bernards, German Shepards, Dobermans, Rottweillers...the list of larger dogs goes on.
it still comes down to the owner of the dog and how that dog has been raised and trained to be the best dog it can be.

Aug. 22 2013 10:16 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Beth Price Almeida from Clanton, Alabama

So you didn't attend the illustrious University of Phoenix? Why did you list it on your profile then? The fact you haven't been on in a year doesn't change anything. Why did you lie if you didn't attend or why are you lying now ? Why do you lie? And if you did go from 2010-2012 how did you skip ahead 4 years and get a Masters in 2012 too... I guess it doesn't matter. Anyone can see you're a tool, it's just fun helping YOU see it too.

Look, according to your blog you've put on a lot of weight lately, why doncha just have an eclair and think it over tubby. I may not be a "jackass". I might be a wake up call. You need to make some positive changes in your life like putting down the werewolf sex books and the doritos and stopping all the lying and pit bull fetishizing and geting outdoors and away from all this "thinking" which is only going to make you feel more inadequate and fill you with self loathing.

Aug. 22 2013 10:10 PM
Beth Price Almeida from Clanton, Alabama

Okay, dude you are just a jackass. You are wrong PERIOD. Further, I haven't been on LinkedIn in over a year. I finished my Master's Degree in Psychology at the University of Alabama last year and stayed on the President's list.I also said you must not be a high school graduate either. You are the absolute most ignorant person on this page and you should just shut up. I don't know why I even decided to argue with you. A person who uses made up facts to prove a point obviously already knows that they are wrong. A nimrod such as yourself will never make a difference anywhere so I don't have to worry about it. That is all.

Aug. 22 2013 09:40 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

OMFG. Do you want to laugh? Really?

Check this out:

This person:

"BethPriceAlmeida"

who wrote this comment to me:

"You must not be college educated or high school for that matter if you think that site is reliable reference material."

is this person:

http://www.linkedin.com/pub/beth-price-price/2b/26/8b0

An alumni of the University of Phoenix (!!!) 2010-12

Oh god, my sides, they're splitting.... please Beth, honor me with another post, I had no idea I was conversing with an alumnus of America's most prestigious for-profit noncompetitive online college!

Hey Diego, how's your head man? How's that headache haha?

Aug. 22 2013 09:24 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Diego Ramos

Sorry I scare you Diego haha ... you seem creepy too. If you have a headache you can turn off the computer haha or stop reading my posts haha.

@ BethPriceAlmeida

Beth. What can I say to you Beth. Wikipedia is not a primary source but it does compile and link to a lot of primary sources like news reports. All the Pit Bull child and baby killings have links to the very sad news stories that reported the child and baby deaths so you can verify yourself if they are factual. Go do that why doncha do thatand then tell me which one was fabricated. Thanks a bunch kiddo.

Aug. 22 2013 09:00 PM
Diego Ramos

Mr Bad.... You're giving me a headache with your nonsense. It really is just nonsense but I don't expect you to see any other way other than what you see. And that is perfectly ok. Just shut up already haha.

And Im really annoyed with the fact that I had to type " Mr bad " .... kinda creepy....

Aug. 22 2013 08:54 PM

PLEASE check your source information before you post garbage! WIKIPEDIA IS NOT a reliable source because any idiot can post their own opinions and call it fact. Of course idiots must make up their facts sooo I guess wikipedia does have a purpose. You must not be college educated or high school for that matter if you think that site is reliable reference material.

Aug. 22 2013 08:51 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Jackie from Indianapolis

Thanks for the reasonable response but I'm still left scratching my head by your comments. How would banning and sterilizing Pit Bulls be like "banning an ethnic minority"? Come on now. Are you serious? A dog is a dog. A person is a person. Yes dogs are living creatures but they are not people. In the eyes of the law they are property. And I am not and have never advocated cruelty towards or euthanasia of(unless absolutely necessary, but that goes for any dog) Pit Bulls but they are a clear and growing public safety problem and it is really dispiriting to see otherwise intelligent people conflating public safety issues with PC politics.

As I've stated before, yes, any dog can be aggressive, and small dogs (toy breeds) bite far more often than any other breed of dog. So. What. When was the last time a Toy breed, Dachshund or Chihuahua killed a child or infant... ? An adult? Never. But Pit Bulls kill and maim ALL THE TIME. Selfish, deluded people are keeping Pit Bulls and they are killing more children and infants every year. But that doesn't matter because "a sad world it would be without them". Sickening. Go to this page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States

The really chilling thing that becomes obvious when you start reading the descriptions and clicking on the links to the news reports (start around 2004) is that the vast majority of Pit Bull victims are children and babies, upwards of 75% on a year by year basis and a large proportion of those dogs killed members of their own families, not just neighbor kids who wandered into the wrong yard. And those are just the fatalities, not the maulings and maimings and close calls, both reported and unreported.

I hope you have a great day too, but I couldn't sleep at night if I felt the way you do.

Aug. 22 2013 08:25 PM
Jackie from Indianapolis

Mr. Bad from NYC,

We all have different perceptions and outlooks on what is right. This shouldn't be made into an "I'm better than you because..." debate. True, there are many statistics that keep pit bulls in the limelight for aggressive behavior, but there are many more statistics from other dogs that aren't in the media. I've known people who have been bitten by tiny yippee dogs to older calm dogs. It's part of history that we associate certain behaviors with specific dogs, but there's more to it. It doesn't matter what breed; it matters how the owner raised them, what is being done to them (i.e. I'm sure the dog didn't appreciate the child riding it like a horse and it made it known--unfortunately it was too strong for the child), and if they feel like there is danger. I've been bitten by a dachshund (a family dog--and one whom belonged to my grandparents) because I tried petting it.

I understand everyone is entitled to their own opinions and has their favorite dog breed, but it doesn't necessarily give the White House authority to ban a specific breed. It'd be like banning an ethnic minority in America.

We realize where you're coming from and even though I strongly disagree, I hope you can understand the other side's opinion as well. Have a great day.

Aug. 22 2013 07:51 PM

Mr. Bad from NYC~Maybe the problem is that YOU aren't normal. Sterilize all APBT's? You are missing the point. People who love this breed know what a sad world it would be without them. You keep speaking of intelligence so I'm thinking maybe you are a little jealous of the intelligence others are exhibiting while all you can do is slam these dogs? What a sad world it is with you in it. You speak as if all Pit Bulls are out to get you. Did you forget to take your medication today?

Aug. 22 2013 07:10 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

Pit Bulls make LOVELY family dogs! Did you know they used to be called the "nanny dog". Just ask these children and infants who died in 2013!

#Arianna Jolee Nerrbach--5 years old---Killed after walking up to a chained dog that belonged to her aunt.

#Nephi Selu ---6 years old---- The boy was attempting to ride the dog "like a horse" when he was bitten a single time on the top of the head.

#Beau Rutledge ---2 years old---The boy was killed while the mother stepped away to use the restroom. The dog was 8-years-old and neighbors said they had never thought it was aggressive

#Tyler Jett ---7 years old----Attacked while riding his bike by his neighbor's two dogs and died 5 days later.

#Monica Renee Laminack---21 months old---Killed by dogs belonging to her mother's boyfriend.

#Daxton Borchardt---14 Months old---Killed by his babysitter's two dogs at the babysitter's residence.

#Ryan Maxwell---7 years old---Killed by a dog that was kept chained in the back yard of a home he was visiting.

#saiah Aguilar---2 years old---Killed in a neighbor's yard by a dog tied up in the yard.

#Christian Gormanous--4 years old---Climbed over a fence and got too close to the neighbor's tethered dog.

And that's just 2013! 2012 and preceeding years were filled with far, far more gruesome "Nanny Dog" action. Read on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States

Aug. 22 2013 05:31 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Melissa

Look I'm not saying you're NOT a genius, you may well be, it just doesn't seem very likely given the content of your comments. You do have a quality, I'd call it arrogance, that a lot of very intelligent people have (it never occurs to them that they may be wrong) but then again a lot of total morons have that same quality in spades so I'm confused. I guess it will remain a mystery to us all.

Perhaps these few stunning gems plucked from the flowing, scintillating prose of your comments, a veritable intellectual broadside, can provide some evidence either way?

"No amount of research can allow you to feel the love, affection, obedience, patience, and care that having an APBT as a pet can."

Clearly Pro Science/Statistical Analysis

"Yea, apparently you are more thick headed than a APBT's skull."

Again, Pro Science, reference to biological feature of Pit Bull

"My dog is my LIFE. He would NEVER hurt anyone or anything"

Wow - SO Pro Science, uses evidence to predict future events with certainty

"@ Mr. Idiot from NYC"

Clever, very smart, substituted "Mr. Idiot" for my handle "Mr. Bad" to imply that I am an idiot. Heady stuff.

"You are just an ignorant yankee"

Mindblowing, assays my knowledge and character based on my geographic location. Possibly psychic?

"I won't even attempt to state facts to you anymore, sir."

Never stated any facts to begin with, didn't need to, Genius level intelligence self evident. Very geniusy all around.

THAT SETTLES IT! You are a genius!

JK. Melissa... I'm laughing at the superior intellect. Y'all come back soon now, ya hear?

Aug. 22 2013 05:01 PM
Melissa

I said I wasn't going to come back to this, but for some reason I did. Shame on me. Not coming back after this post though. You are doing nothing more than wasting my time and insulting someone you do not know. I could be 16 years old and you could be 50. How does it make you feel to think that you could actually be attempting to get the last word in, and insulting the intelligence of, a 16 year old? Ha. I'm not 16, but that's besides the point.

Actually, it is; however, I don't think that me proving that to you would matter either way. I do not care if someone on this idiotic thread believes what my IQ is or not. Lol. Like I am really attempting to impress a ton of biased Yankee fools? Give me a break. Glad you found humor in it though... I guess? Scurry along now with whatever brain function you have left.

Aug. 22 2013 04:20 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

160 is such a nice round number, isn't it folks? In case y'all didn't know it 160 and up is considered to be Genius level intelligence, though they don't use that word anymore. Brian Lehrer's IQ is 168 and you can easily tell that by the number of times he says "bless your heart" or "you need jeebus" during the show... ROFL!

Aug. 22 2013 04:15 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Melissa

160 IQ. ROFL. I mean, c'mon, give me a break, nobody who reads this comment section will ever believe that in a million years... you're priceless.

It's such an odd claim to make too. It's obvious you're defensive and insecure about your intelligence and feel you got shellacked in this little exchange. Don't you see that when you start claiming to be a genius despite the fact you can barely write 4 sentences without mentioning jeebus you are making yourself a laughingstock and losing all credibility?

Aug. 22 2013 04:09 PM
Melissa

I won't even attempt to state facts to you anymore, sir. You are far worse off than I originally thought.
But I will say that using any wiki source as a credible source automatically makes your entire argument invalid.
And no worries. I have absolutely NO desire to come to "yankee land". I'd rather keep my IQ where it sits at 160, my gun where it sits right on my hip, and my pup, where he sits right the hell next to me wherever I go.
Bless your little heart.

Aug. 22 2013 04:01 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Melissa

Quotes from the ASPCA article, and this is a "pro-pit bull" article:

"They’re easily excited and, when in an agitated state, they may have little control over their behavior if they haven’t been taught to inhibit their impulses. This trait has given pit bulls a reputation for being “mouthy”—they tend to bite harder in play than other breeds. They are also quite stoic and can be insensitive to pain."

"Pit bulls aren’t vicious monsters—but they are dogs who have been bred to fight with other dogs. While some pit bulls are indeed very easygoing, others should not be left alone with other dogs, cats or other pets. Pit bulls are strong, determined dogs. It might not be a pit bull who starts a disagreement, but he may be the one to finish it."

"Pit bulls may become aggressive more quickly when exposed to the hectic, high-octane energy of a dog park environment. If there’s a squabble, a pit bull may be one of the first dogs to jump into the fray. For these reasons, many responsible pit bull parents find other ways to exercise their dogs."

"Pit bulls have been bred to behave differently during a fight. They may not give warning before becoming aggressive, and they’re less likely to back down when clashing with an opponent. When provoked, they may become aggressive more readily than another breed might. Sometimes they don’t inhibit their bites, so they may cause injury more often than other dogs."

"Most experts agree that today’s pit bull is a short-coated dog characterized by a wide skull, powerful jaws and a muscular, stocky body. But there is great variation in the pit bull’s appearance. Typically 35 to 65 pounds, some weigh as little as 25 pounds, while others tip the scales at 80 pounds or more. Some have bulkier frames and colossal skulls; others have leaner, more muscular bodies. All are strong and athletic."

Soooooooooo... a vicious, aggressive, unstoppable land shark immune to pain and equipped to kill, instinctually vicious and dangerous even at play responsible for roughly half of all fatal dog attacks in the USA since 2006 and thousands more attacks of people and animals:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States

What responsible pet owner wouldn't want one?

Keep your jeebus and your vicious animal far away from Yankee land and we'll both be happy.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/22/pitbulls-kitten-destroy-van_n_1822274.html

Aug. 22 2013 03:54 PM
Melissa

On a side note, I was bitten by a chihuahua mix once and my pit just pushed it away. Literally took his paw, put it on the tiny ankle biter's head, and pushed him away. No, I was not hurt badly at this incident, but my pit protected me as well while using the least amount of force possible. Before I had my pit, I was bitten by that chihuahua and had to go to the hospital for stitches. Should we bad those? Or how about the owners who state "oh he just nips a lot. hahahaha." Nips? Really? A nip doesn't require stitches. Or how about we ban the Collie that chased me when I was 10, growling, barking, and catching up with me. I ran inside my house and it came to the door, scratching and clawing trying to get inside. What was I doing to cause this? playing in my tree house. In my 2 acre yard. Away from the crazy Collie. Should we ban them as well? What about sharks? They kill people. What about poisonous snakes? I know people who have copperheads as freaking pets. They aren't banned, yet they have the potential to kill people as well. Shoot, why not ban cars? cell phones? cigarettes? They have all contributed to the death of thousands. Ban those as well while you're at it.

Aug. 22 2013 03:47 PM
Melissa

@ Mr. Idiot from NYC
You ARE joking, right?? Pit Bulls are NOT naturally aggressive. It has been proven time and time again! Not only that, but it has been proven that out of a retriever, german shepherd, rott, and pit bull, you are least likely to be attacked by the pit. The pit would hurt you more IF it attacked you than the retriever, but not more than the GS or the Rott. You are just an ignorant yankee with nothing better to do in your spare time than go around social media and post unintellectual, false claims and state that they are facts.
“I really pity all these Pit Bull lovers. It's only a question of when their pet "snaps" and attacks someone. Hopefully it will be the owner and not some innocent schmuck but it doesn't usually work out that way. Keep your kids indoors pals...” HAHA really dude? Gah, I’d LOVE to meet you one day so that I could politely slap the hell out of you for your lack of knowledge. Maybe then it would knock some sense into you. But then again, you probably voted for Obama as well. Again, I’ll pray for you. You need it more than most people I believe.

Aug. 22 2013 03:40 PM
socityiscrazy from al

I was once attacked by mixed breed a very large one at that he was a family pet my 75 pound pit jumped a five foot feance and pined the dog only biteing it once he did not kill the other nor even really caused it harm my pit was a rescue from a breeder now tell me if i should have my hero to sleep because you think that one breed is is dangerous while others need to be looked over oh btw im one finger down because of that other dog

Aug. 22 2013 03:34 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Jackie from Indianapolis, IN

Yeah, German Shepherds can be dangerous too but unlike a Pit Bull (though this is also true of all terrier breeds) they are renowned for their intelligence and potential for training and obedience. Pit Bulls are NATURALLY aggressive, vicious dogs that require a dedicated and expertly trained handler/owner to be considered biddable. You would think that with all the macho cops and soldiers out there somebody would try and sell them on the "bad boy" pit bull breed but no takers? Wonder why? Because they are not to be trusted and cannot be relied on to obey direction when they decide to go on a tear. Great family dog though, that's the sort of temperament you want in a family pet, amiright?

I really pity all these Pit Bull lovers. It's only a question of when their pet "snaps" and attacks someone. Hopefully it will be the owner and not some innocent schmuck but it doesn't usually work out that way. Keep your kids indoors pals...

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Pit-Bull-Attacks-Children-in-Maryland-217635601.html

Aug. 22 2013 03:29 PM
Melissa

Yea, apparently you are more thick headed than a APBT's skull.
Telling me to 'give up my pit'? Excuse the hell out of you, but you need some serious Jesus. Bless your little heart.

Aug. 22 2013 03:10 PM
Jackie from Indianapolis, IN

Breeds that have been banned throughout history: German Shepherds, Greyhounds, and now Pit Bulls.

When will people realize it's not the dog or the breed, it's the owner. There are terrible people out there that train these dogs to fight and that's all the dog knows. The White House needs a reality check and start severely punishing unsuitable owners and better enforce the ban against dog fights.

Aug. 22 2013 03:07 PM
Jeffrey Morrison from Ridgewood NJ

I hate to come down so hard on a guest, but really, a SVP spokesperson for the ASCPA calling the most popular breed "Laboratory (sic) Retrievers" twice and then equating the jobs assigned them in the miltary to the jobs assigned the "guard dog" breeds is preposterous.

To think that scores of selective selection of traits in breeds has left no impact on these breeds is nonsense.

Also, shouldn't someone teach her the difference between fewer and less.

Not to be too snarky, but is she related to the Texas Perrys?

Aug. 22 2013 02:52 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@Beth Almeida from Clanton, Alabama

You do realize that to a normal person you seem insane? You're not helping your cause and I never wrote that Pit Bulls should be "shot". You could very easily require licensing, insurance and mandatory sterilization for all the Pit Bulls alive now. We could be done with this menace in a single generation and without euthanasia or animal cruelty.

Aug. 22 2013 02:52 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Melissa

You wrote:

"My dog is my LIFE. He would NEVER hurt anyone or anything"

Clearly you are an unbiased, clear headed and objective observer of the factual circumstances not the "bleeding heart doofus" I was thinking of when I wrote my little post, however, there are some holes in your logic.

First of all the dogs rescued from Michael Vick did not become "service dogs" like for instance a seeing eye dog, they became "therapy dogs", which is to say they are shuttled around for people to pet by an experienced handler for PR purposes. They are never left on their own. They have not been adopted into families and 22 of the 50 are still living in a no kill shelter because they cannot be adopted out due to their aggressive nature. Any animal if properly trained and supervised can be made reasonably "safe". Are you claiming that most Pit Bulls have been trained and socialized for hundreds of hours by professionals and will continue to be for life?

What's the point of pointing out that Pit Bulls are technically "American Pit Bull Terrier, Staffordshire Bull Terrier, and American Staffordshire Terrier"? You can ban them all just the same as "Pit Bulls". Pointless waste of verbiage.

The ASPCA states clearly in the article I linked to in my last post that while most dogs (not unlike people) fight in a ritualized fashion, gnashing teeth, growling, etc but seldom if ever fighting to the death while Pit Bulls DO NOT. Here is the exact text:

"Pit bulls have been bred to behave differently during a fight. They may not give warning before becoming aggressive, and they’re less likely to back down when clashing with an opponent. When provoked, they may become aggressive more readily than another breed might. Sometimes they don’t inhibit their bites, so they may cause injury more often than other dogs."

So you have "a short-coated dog characterized by a wide skull, powerful jaws and a muscular, stocky body" that is fundamentally more aggressive and yes, vicious, than other dogs. Case closed.

When you wrote "Don't group us into one category like that. That is as bad as being racist or sexist. It's discrimination." I LOL'd so hard everyone came over to see what I was reading.

Get help and give up your pit bull life partner before it's too late.

Aug. 22 2013 02:47 PM
Beth Almeida from Clanton, Alabama

"However, it’s important to realize that even though a breed may be characterized by certain behaviors, individuals of the same breed can vary tremendously. Some dogs are courageous, while others are timid. Some dogs are tenacious, while others are easygoing. Some dogs are sociable, while others are aloof. Like people, all dogs have unique personalities."
http://www.aspca.org/pet-care/virtual-pet-behaviorist/dog-behavior/truth-about-pit-bulls

Mr. Bad from NYC~ I hate to be ugly...wait really I don't. I read the article that YOU posted to back up your insane and ignorant theory about APBT. What I read was that these dogs were bred first to be hunters and then as loyal companions. Are YOU loyal to anyone, even yourself? I ask because if you are, if you love that person beyond belief, you would do everything in your power and I mean EVERYTHING to make that person happy. APBT's are the same. The above quote sums it perfectly; '...like people ALL dogs have UNIQUE PERSONALITIES.' Let's take your post for example. It is a perfect instance of the uniqueness of people like you who are uneducated about something and yet you STILL want to spew hate and spread fear...while others are knowledgeable enough that they can speak intelligently about these wonderful dogs. For you, in a perfect world, these loving, loyal, amazingly WONDERFUL dogs would not exist. In my perfect world, people who spread hate and fear by speaking on a topic of which they are CLEARLY ignorant would be sent to the moon. See? There's that uniqueness again. The article you used as a reference didn't blame the dog. It was clear that the dangerous and violent animal in that article was man.
For everyone else who thinks that APBT's should be banned or shot or whatever; You have a better chance of being killed by your pajamas due to spontaneous combustion than of being bitten by an APBT! Let's just stop with stupidity and paranoia, shall we?

Aug. 22 2013 02:34 PM
Melissa

Obviously, most of you guys are ignorant. For one, 'pit bull' is a description, not a breed. American Pit Bull Terrier, Staffordshire Bull Terrier, and American Staffordshire Terrier are the only dogs that are technically, and I use that the term 'technically' loosely, "pit bulls". Second, the ONLY breed that has the words "pit bull" in it's name is the American Pit Bull Terrier. People will classify boxer's, cane corso's, rhodesian ridgeback's, bulldog's, and many other's as "pit bull's" when they are not. THAT is how the term pit bull became synonymous with the words 'aggressive', 'dangerous', 'killer', etc. People badly breeding these incredible dogs, and calling them pure bred. APBT's are KNOWN for their affection for the human race and obedience. They do as they are told. If their owner tells them to fight other dogs, they fight. Not because they want to, but because that is what their owner tells them to do. And to survive. If I was put in a fighting ring, you can bet I will fight to the death if I had to. Anyone would. It's survival instincts. You can't tell me you wouldn't. But I digress. ANYWAYS, there have been many cases of "pit bulls" being rescued from fighting rings, and guess what?! They became service dogs. Yes, you read that right. Service dogs. Even some of Michael Vick's dogs became service dogs! Which brings me to point three, they are not, nor is any breed, inherently dangerous. It is a trait specific to that one dog, not that entire breed of dog. Michael Vick's dogs prove that. If they were inherently dangerous, then once rescued they would have never been able to become service dogs.

Don't sit there and say that all 'pit bull' owners are the same, or that all 'pit bull' owners will get you comfortable with their dog and then tell you about "that time...". Don't group us into one category like that. That is as bad as being racist or sexist. It's discrimination. Not only that, but unless you have ever owned an APBT then you know nothing. No amount of research can allow you to feel the love, affection, obedience, patience, and care that having an APBT as a pet can. They are why we sit here and fight and fight against an almost impossible crowd. They are the reason we do everything we do. My dog is my LIFE. He would NEVER hurt anyone or anything. Yet he is the one who has to suffer by not being allowed to go to certain places due to how he looks. It's pathetic. And anyone who agrees with any BSL is just as pathetic as the law itself and I will pray for you to find the courage to realize that you are wrong about this breed.

Aug. 22 2013 02:08 PM
Mr. Bad from NYC

It's simply a matter of good intentions run amok. People should not be allowed to keep these dogs as pets, it's obvious. PC qualms aside the animals are dangerous, it's indisputable, and even the ASPCA accepts and promulgates that fact that Pit Bulls are innately aggressive towards other dogs because they have been bred to be for innumerable generations.

http://www.aspca.org/pet-care/virtual-pet-behaviorist/dog-behavior/truth-about-pit-bulls

Even if you accept that they are "only" aggressive towards dogs (and I don't, but at least the ASPCA admits that) you still have a huge problem because we do not, generally speaking, have packs or feral dogs running around the country (outside of Detroit). Dogs are attached to humans, usually by leashes, and having a dog is like having a kid, you will meet other dogs because you all do the same dog type stuff like go for walks before work, after work, go to parks, dog runs, etc. And most dog owners do not view their dogs as expendable but as beloved companions. Getting in between a pit bull in their prey is not a good idea ... so again, public safety. The people who love these animals are either sociopaths or misguided bleeding heart doofuses, either way they put us all at risk by owning these inherently dangerous animals.

Aug. 22 2013 01:57 PM
joe from brooklyn

The ASPCA rep may have a point about the over regulation of breeds not helping. However does a person's right to own a dog capable of killing or maiming a person outweigh my right to not have my family or self attacked or killied by an animal capable of doing so? In Brooklyn I regularly see people with large dogs capable of doing harm. Many of these people are teens or irresponsible owners who should not be allowed to have these dogs. That is scary. I'm not talking about golden retrievers or poodles here. Are animal rights superior to human rights?

Aug. 22 2013 11:21 AM
clkq

Having lived in an apartment building with an aggressive pit bull and an indifferent owner, I can tell you that there are no laws that take care of a problem dog until there are numerous complaints and maybe even a couple bites. This is a crowded city and to keep a big dog who needs exercise in the tiny spaces we live is just cruel.

Aug. 22 2013 10:55 AM
Mr. Bad from NYC

@ Sue from NYC

It was a 100 dog study! 100 whole dogs! Very scientifical and easy to figure % wise. I think the laboratory retriever was in the top 5 on the intertubes for attacks or something.

Well, I'm convinced! Where do I get my Pit?

Aug. 22 2013 10:54 AM

@ Sue from NYC - I heard her say the same? What? Did I miss a meeting?

Aug. 22 2013 10:51 AM
Sue from NYC

Wait a minute, did your guest just say (twice) LABORATORY retrievers?!

Labrador retrievers is the name.

Aug. 22 2013 10:47 AM
Mr. Bad from NYC

Pit bull owners will swear up and down that their dogs are so gentle and sweet and most of the time they're right but they once they feel comfortable enough you won't judge them they'll tell you about "that time" it attacked another animal or person.

"Oh, and by the way, don't walk up behind me when the dog is watching"

"Oh, and by the way, don't get in between the dog when it's after another animal, even a pet, ya know"

Aug. 22 2013 10:47 AM
lily from saugerties ny

make it harder on the breeders- especially large trophy aggressive breeds
Dogs should not be bought and sold, there are too many wonderful ones who need homes

Aug. 22 2013 10:47 AM
Magnus Westergren from New York

I've lived with pit bulls before, and agree that they can be extremely sweet dogs, however, a small poodle cannot maim a child, large powerful dogs can. On another note, living on the upper east side is like living in an open dog sewer. Dog pee and feces covers the sidewalks and just walking to the corner is a smelly mind field. For that reason I support Singapore-style banning of large dogs, as that would at least reduce the total number of dogs, and the total amount of refuse!

Aug. 22 2013 10:47 AM
laura from brooklyn

The current hysteria around pitbulls is due to the media coverage that is very similar to the late 80's around fears of child molestation in daycare/afterschool programs. Other breeds have bitten and attacked more than the pitbull breed but they're not given the attention in the media that pitbulls are.

Aug. 22 2013 10:47 AM
Katie Kennedy from Huntington

Rather than breed specific, mandate 6 week Obedience courses, preferably for all dogs, but at least for large breeds. I breed small dogs (Cavaliers), but I recommend to anyone with whom I place one of my dogs, to take the six week Obedience course (sit, stay, wait, walk on a lead). I cannot tell you how many people I pass on the street, walking their large dogs, who absolutely cannot control them. Obedience training is the way to go.

Aug. 22 2013 10:46 AM

It's unfair to the dog to keep a big dog in the city!

Aug. 22 2013 10:45 AM
Sue from NYC

I don't really have a position on this issue, never gave it any thought, but laws should be fact- and evidence-based. On the other hand, I would NEVER have an animal in my home that could, physically, rip my throat out.

Aug. 22 2013 10:45 AM
Micheal from Manhattan

Just get the dogs certified with regards to their behaviour. The ASPCA can come up with tests or certifications on the dog's behaviour. All dogs adopted or in a densely populated complex should also be certified by an animal behaviourist.

Aug. 22 2013 10:45 AM
jgarbuz from Queens

The "right" to own an animal and walk him in the city should be considered a privelege, and not some constitutional right. The city should have the right to determine what kinds of animals you can keep as pets, and what kinds should be banned as a menace to the population.
Pit-bulls should DEFINITELY be banned. They are aggressive and dangerous and unpredictable. I'm suspicious of the mental health of those who own them as well.

Aug. 22 2013 10:44 AM
Meg from CT

I support adopting dogs from shelters and have had two outstanding pups (Mulligan and Duffy). I knew nothing of "pitbulls" or, as I prefer, Staffordshire Terriers before adopting them but both of my dogs appear to have some of their characteristics. Never have I known such loving sweet, intelligent dogs. I strongly believe it is my responsibility to make sure my dog isn't disruptive to others whether that is in the park or walking around town. The discussion, as your guest is stressing, needs to be about the humans, not the dogs.

Aug. 22 2013 10:44 AM
john from office

I am tired of "groups" who obtain their "manhood" by having a vicious dog. Yes it is an urban thing. Small minds, small horizons, big dogs.

Try taking care of your kids, before you take on a dog.

Aug. 22 2013 10:44 AM
no PBs!

Too many incidents of pit bull attacks. Something has to be done especially in cities; maybe this isn't the right answer, but don't deny that these dogs will kill other dogs/people.

Aug. 22 2013 10:43 AM
Joyce from NYC

This is just stupid:

- Dobermans used to be dangerous, and then were bred to be more docile. Dogs CAN be bred for behavior.

- Of course a responsible own can have a good Pit Bull. BUT YOU CANNOT TELL ME THAT THERE IS ANY NEED FOR A KID IN PUBLIC HOUSING TO HAVE A PIT BULL !!!!!!!!!!!!

Aug. 22 2013 10:43 AM
Jeanne from NJ

Stop the breed restrictions and create laws that prohibitively punish people who mistreat, torture, and neglect dogs.

Aug. 22 2013 10:42 AM
Mr. Bad from NYC

"Breed Discriminatory" LOL

It's not whether a dog is violent Brian, it's if it has the potential to do serious harm. I'd rather be attacked by a toy poodle 10x than a pit bull once. Also, aggression is a heritable trait, been known for thousands of years. Pit Bulls were bread to kill other dogs, it's a fact. Trying to ban breeds is hard to enforce, but so are a lot of laws, doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

Aug. 22 2013 10:40 AM
Howard from Astoria, NY

Dogs shouldn't be judged based on their breed. They should be based on their individual behavior. If they have done something wrong, acted aggressively towards people or other dogs, then appropriate measures should be taken. But to judge dogs by their breed is akin to judging people by their skin color. Aren't we passed that?

Aug. 22 2013 10:38 AM
inwoodite from nyc

I know a few people who have rescued pit bulls who are very gentle animals. My brother rescued a pit bull (which, alas, tried to kill a few dogs, bit me, and and attacked a friend). I always figured his dog was too old to change his ways when my brother found him. On the whole, every time I walk my dog (a rescued, half blind, older and calmer 15-pound poodle) and we walk past a person with a pit bull in the park, they have to restrain their beast in ways that make me think this can't possibly be one of those gentle souls. It's terrifying the way they act, and the way many of their masters discipline them is hardly reassuring: they're angry, mean, thuggish, and violent towards their dog. So, yes, I guess it's the owners that turn their dogs bad. I feel bad for dogs that have been turned into violent things by their awful owners. But when was the last time someone was nearly killed by a bad pug? The problem with pit bulls is that they're as strong as a grown man. I'm equally leery of aggressive grown men I don't know. So don't take it personally, pit bull owners. I just don't like living beings that are big enough to take me.
I've learned not to look at pit bulls at all and to stay as far away from them as possible.

Aug. 22 2013 10:36 AM

Leave a Comment

Email addresses are required but never displayed.