Streams

Crunchtime in Albany: Gay Marriage

Monday, June 08, 2009

A weeklong series looking at the important legislation likely to be voted on before the session ends later this month. Today: Gay Marriage. Ruben Diaz, New York State Senator (D-32nd Bronx) and Pentecostal minister, explains why he’s taking the lead against gay marriage. Then, Liz Krueger, New York State Senator (D-Manhattan, 26th district), makes the case for its passage.

Guests:

Ruben Diaz and Liz Krueger

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Comments [243]

John

The Bible doesn't exactly "condone" slavery:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bible_and_slavery

Jun. 14 2009 03:32 PM
Yan from Upper West Side

Diaz sounds like a mix between Robert Mugabe and Carlos Mencia. what an idiot!

Jun. 11 2009 09:46 AM
Milos from Queens

Dear Kamal (#238) - My liver is very calm and I gave my views in a calm state of mind. I am not in a rage. I am not "unhinged." I believe that elected officials should be held to high standards, and I do indeed consider Mr. Diaz a cousin of the Taliban. Like the Taliban, he is self-righteously motivated to deny basic civil rights to others on the basis of religion. Like the Taliban, he sees no conflict in bringing religion into the political sphere and, indeed, believes they are one and the same. Both have a theocratic worldview, based on the notion that their particular religion is the true religion, and anyone who disagrees with them is an infidel, or a sinner, if you prefer. The Taliban use the Koran to justify their barbarism, and Mr. Diaz uses the Bible to justify his bigotry. You are right that the degree of violence and insanity perpetrated by the Taliban far exceeds anything we've seen from Mr. Diaz, but ideologically they are made of the same cloth. I fear, reject and abhor them both.

Jun. 09 2009 11:29 PM
hjs from 11211

you might like to know espada monserrate & diaz all ran unopposed by any major party. I guess the GOP was happy with them long ago.

Jun. 09 2009 11:07 AM
James B from NYC

# 30 above - "It's incredible this guy is an elected official (although I guess that says something about his constituency)."
# 40 above - "the ignorant citizens in this guys' district elected him into office. this is a microcosm of the idiotic population of this country as a whole that elected bush TWICE!"
# 48 above - "I agree with Bernard in his comment--How can this man be an elected official? What a travesty!"
# 51 above - "I truly feel sorry for his constituents. He is terribly incoherent and makes no sense whatsoever. The people in the Bronx need a stronger advocate."
# 54 above - "A state senator! Wow, who voted for him? This is too hard to believe."
# 55 above - "Who is this guy? Why is someone like him able to get so much power?"
# 58 above - "Can't believe this guy is an elected official, what a tool."
# 63 above - "How stupid is the constituency that elected him???!!!"
# 67 above - "Gay marriage or not, this guy is an idiot. What constituency is he representing????"
# 73 above - "I cannot believe this idiot is an elected official"
# 78 above - "it's scary to me that this guy diaz represents the district he does. he lacks basic reasoning skills, for pete's sake! he's all over the place..."
# 83 above - "PLEASE ask this moron what's worse for children: being raised by a 16-year old unmarried girl who drops out of high school or being raised by two adult, educated, high-earning people who really WANT a child?"
# 85 above - "and now I understand why the Bronx is the way it is..."
# 87 above - "Most interesting and depressing is that Diaz was VOTED into office and representing a district."
# 88 above - ""This guy" represents the community that voted him into office."

Indeed, welcome to the wisdom of the people!

Jun. 09 2009 03:03 AM
kamal from Bronx

#237 - calm your liver

Diaz is not a Taliban - it's a grotesque comparison = yoiu need to learn to disagree civilly with someone who differs with you on gay marriage.

Last I checked Taliban beheaded women in stadium because they didn't share the fanatical Islamist worldview of the Taliban. Diaz is not blowing up other religions historic places of worship like the Taliban.

You hurt the gay cause with your unhinged rhetoric against Diaz who is an elected official.

By smearing Diaz with such rage, you exhibit your own brand of fanaticism.

Jun. 08 2009 09:37 PM
Milos from Queens

Brian, you did not do your homework on Ruben Diaz, who is truly an evil man. Diaz is not stupid -- on the contrary, he's a savvy politician who has garnered support within his community by turning himself into a demigod and taking the low road: spewing religiously-justified hate among his conservative, Catholic constituency. He is clearly unfit to hold public office, as he tramples on the separation of church and state and tells us how "hurt" his religion would be if two guys got married somewhere. But he's also a populist, liked within his district for other reasons. You should have known more about his record, and forced him to stay focused on his completely illegal attempt to turn New York State into a theocracy. At least many more people now know that he's a warped, dangerous, Christian version of the Taliban.

Jun. 08 2009 09:30 PM
Voter from Brooklyn

PT 3
Senator Krueger starts by saying senators are “not technically in the religion business” but “in the civil law business.” Followed by saying religion wasn’t relevant in the conversation and that it’s a matter of the 1300 rights and benefits bestowed upon married couples by the state. Much like Senator Diaz, Senator Krueger also supports having the vote regardless the outcome so everyone will know where each senator stands. When asked if the legislators should be involved in an issue that makes New Yorkers “squeamish”, the senator replies, it’s a matter of civil rights and draws comparisons to former slaves, women, and suffrage. The call that was taken during her much shorter interview than that of Senator Diaz was one that did oppose her view, albeit from someone who doesn’t understand how state marriage laws work citing Mass law and being offended one state would recognize marriages from another state. Then the caller asked if he should be allowed to change his classification to that of a child or an elderly person or if fathers should be able to marry their sons and daughters for property rights… guess he forgot about inheritance.
Senator Krueger simply didn’t say anything controversial other than that religion doesn’t have a place in the state legislature. Is this the thing Brian should have attacked vociferously?

Jun. 08 2009 06:04 PM
Voter from Brooklyn

PT 2
The topic of the recent killing of a physician who performed late term abortions came about when Brian read a quote from Senator Diaz equating doctors who perform abortions with Hitler’s final solution. Senator Diaz considers them moral equivalents and only retracted his comment because Jews were offended. Then Senator Diaz went on to contradict himself several times by saying all killing is wrong… abortion, murder, capital punishment, and assassinating Hitler to stop him from killing Jews would all be wrong, but “during war, all is legal” (I assume this includes Guantanamo and Abu Ghriab) and he would have “killed if I had to kill” when he was in the service only to conclude he was opposed to killing (abortion, capital punishment) “in any which way”. Senator Diaz ends by saying homosexuality is a sin against nature because the Bible says so.

Jun. 08 2009 06:04 PM
Voter from Brooklyn

I re-listened to the segment to see if I could detect this clear bias that comments are claiming Brian had in this interview, and it simply isn’t there.
Senator Rubin Diaz Sr. made sweeping generalizations and blatant falsehoods to bolster is position and the host was calling him on his claims. Also, there was a clear difference on how Senator Diaz and Senator Krueger approached the issue. The former from his personal religious beliefs and the latter from a duty to uphold civil laws with deference to the US Constitution. Though I personally think one should have a better grasps on the prevailing language before being elected to public office (regardless the primary language of their constituents), Senator Diaz got his point across just fine.
To suggest blanket comments saying same-sex civil marriage would hurt “the whole family” and “the whole institution [of marriage]” or that “the Bible didn’t condone slavery” and that social traditions from the founding of the US shouldn’t be changed (e.g. slavery, the non-personhood of blacks and natives, the role of women as property of their husbands, the lack of rights for non-property owning white males, children as laborers, the right of states to discriminate on the basis of religion (the 1st Amendment originally applied to the federal government, not the states), etc) should go unchallenged is baffling. To suggest that comments like “Everyone gets hurt”, “My beliefs get hurt”, “My understanding of family values gets hurt”, “My belief in the Bible gets hurt” from a state Senator are perfectly ok in a democracy is even more galling. It’s not all about Mr. Diaz when legislating the lives of 19+ million people.

Jun. 08 2009 06:03 PM
hjs from 11211

and now 2 phony dems have jumped the ship rather than giving human rights to a handful of gays and lesbians.
sad day in the history of democracy

Jun. 08 2009 05:07 PM
leroy from Brooklyn

Interviewing State Sen. Diaz about the basis of his views on homosexual marriage is certainly legitimate, but that wasn't an interview, it was an inquisition! Not only did Brian not make an effort to hide his pro-homosexual bias, he put it on full rainbow display. Why wasn't there a similar questioning of the hypocrisy upon which the views of State Sen. Krueger is based? Clearly the answer is that Brian shares her views and does not question the underlying hypocrisy. And talk about hypocrisy! When Diaz pointed out a glaring contradiction in Lehrer's position, Brian simply ignored his well-reasoned argument preferring instead to accuse State Sen. Diaz of sharing responsibility for Dr. Tiller's murder! That was just vicious. I could almost hear Lehrer foaming at the mouth.

This was a low in journalism and certainly not what we have come to expect from Brian Lehrer. It's a shame to see a talented journalist sacrifice his professional standards to his personal bias. He has lost all objectivity on this issue. He should leave it alone. Given what transpired today however,I don't think he can. He's too addicted to the homosexual kool-aid.

Jun. 08 2009 04:11 PM
Sandra from Astoria, Queens

When will the public be able to vote on straight marriage?

Jun. 08 2009 04:03 PM
Yvonne from Brooklyn, New York

To: the truth from bkny

"It is defended as one would a race of people ..."

Wake up! No one has ever said homosexuals as a group represent a race anymore than women as a group, the disabled, etc. represent races. True, Jews have been treated historically as a race though Judaism is actually a religion but the issue you seem to miss is the history of discrimination.

What homosexuals have in common with African-Americans is the history of discrimination. At one point, it was illegal for Blacks to marry each other never-mind intermarry with white people. Anytime one can be beaten to death for no other reason than one belongs to a particular group no matter how that group is, otherwise, defined than all members of that group have the same civil rights issues as members of other groups treated the same way.

But let's get to the real issue. Did Jesus make everybody agree with him first before he reached out, healed, etc. ...No, he did not. He accepted the humanity of all and was, especially, an advocate for those others discriminated against.

As a Black atheist, I am always amazed at how Christians are so unlike Christ. It was crosses, after all, that the KKK burned in front of Black homes. It was Christians who wrote newspaper headlines that announced there would be a burning of Negroes ... "young girls too" and Christians who read and went to the burning on Saturday and church on Sunday. When priests in the "New World", upset at the treatment of Africans and Native Americans, wrote their superiors in Europe for guidance, the reply was that there had been consultation all the way up the hierarchy and the final word was that they should not worry because these creatures have no soul. Where was the Pope during slavery?? during the holocaust??

How dare you hold any of this up as moral authority when obviously it has been morally bankrupt all along!! Jesus would be just as bewildered to see what his followers do in his name!

Jun. 08 2009 03:34 PM
hjs from 11211

Irving
first they were both democrats but that aside.
if a nazi was on the air explaining why gays should be marched into the gay chambers should the host also "make a stronger effort to control his biases" hate is hate.

Jun. 08 2009 03:24 PM
Irving Jacks

This morning I listened to the Brian Lehrer interviews with Ruben Diaz and Liz krueger. As a frequentlisteneer to Wnyc and to the BL show, as well as a supporter of gay marriage and abortion rights, I was appalled at the blatant partisanship exhibited by Lahrer. He was adversarial and prosecutorial toward Diaz, while cozying up to Krueger. I do think he ought to make a stronger effort to control his biasses, be a bit more nonpartisan, if he is going to maintain the guise of non-,or atleast, bi-partisanship. At the very least, be open about your bias.

Jun. 08 2009 03:15 PM
hjs from 11211

truth
"Funny you want to see women only subway cars though " do I??

hate is hate. i know it when i see it.

Jun. 08 2009 03:12 PM
Jennifer

It's terrifying to me that this ignoramus is in the state legislature. How does anything ever get done in Albany with these yokels in office? Equality for all! Separation of church and state!

Jun. 08 2009 03:07 PM
Voter from Brooklyn

Michael B (#222),

How could Brian have conducted the interview any differently? (And believe me, I often disagree with the way he conducts interviews… just look back to my comments on his interview with the GM dealer and Executive, that was a total joke, especially while holding a hand out (the pledge drive) claiming to be a source for informed dialogue.)

Inabilities with the language aside, Senator Diaz’s argument was purely a faith based one built around what the Bible says and who can and cannot procreate through direct sexual intercourse. Brian challenged him on using a religious text and the ability to mate naturally or unaided as a requirement for state recognition of a legally binding contract. Senator Krueger’s first comment was in effect that senators are not in the religion business , but in the civil law business. Should Brian have made an argument that the state is in the religious business, First Amendment be dammed?

I understand your criticism of the listener comments, but, in this case, I can’t see how you can fault the host. (Well, unless you provied an example of where Brian was treating the latter guest with kid gloves)

Jun. 08 2009 02:11 PM
hjs from 11211

Yvonne
i'm sorry. i just skimmed your first line and
jumped to the wrong conclusion. my bad.
thanks for correcting me.

Jun. 08 2009 01:57 PM
the truth from bkny

Thanks voter! That is what I wrote, those are my opions, period. HJS, just b/c you don't agree, it is NOT hate. Funny you want to see women only subway cars though huh HJS?

Jun. 08 2009 01:51 PM
MichaelB from Morningside Heights

Brian, you completely fell down on this topic. You challenged Diaz all the way through but when it came to Krueger, in effect, you merely asked her to present her views and asked for some clarification here and there.

True, Diaz was not very articulate and his argument was mostly religiously-based, which may be HIS argument against gay marriage, and makes him an easy target for supporters of gay marriage, but religious ones are not the only relevant arguments to be made.

I know this was about the NYS legistlature's posture on the issue and it is not your job to prop up one, so you have a legitimate excuse, but as far as providing an even balanced "discussion" (which is not fairly applicable to the segment), that failed miserably.

Look at the more than 200 comments. Overwhelmingly one-sided and terribly mean-spirited and insulting. And insultnig and condescending not only to Diaz, but to his constiuency as well.

You ought to do a follow up on the comments and a separate segment on how liberalism too often falls short of its ideals of openmindedness. Too often, democracy is an abastraction and only supported when it produces desired results. Of what use is free speech when we listen only to what we already believe?

It is one thing to close yourself off from the other side -- conservatives absolutely do this too. But it is quite another to delude yourself and boast that you are enlightenened, progressive and openminded, but in fact you can only insult and marginalize those who express opinions that differ from your own.

But those are the listeners. I expect a more even-handed approach by you Brian, which you usually provide and which is one of your hallmarks.

Jun. 08 2009 01:49 PM
Yvonne from Brooklyn, New York

To hjs from from 11211:

I don't understand your response to my pointing out the contradictions in what Christians say when they base their ideas on the bible but, then, cherry pick which parts of the bible to follow and which parts to ignore.

I am an atheist.

Your reply has nothing to do with what I said.

Jun. 08 2009 01:45 PM
hjs from 11211

voter
thanks

truth
it is hate. you are the same as a southern lynchers. it's sad that u can't see that, this may never change but in time archie bunkers like u will be part of history.

Jun. 08 2009 01:43 PM
Voter from Brooklyn

The truth at 10:24AM (comment 102): “[Senator Diaz] is unable to articulate himself in English, but, that is the truth he just spoke there. Same sexes cannot pro-create”

The truth at 10:26AM (comment 111): “One of the partners will certainly NOT be included in the creation of the child… …All you are doing is confusing the natural order of the birthing process, how can you all not see that this is unnatural?”

The truth at 11:23AM (comment 177): “…but no one is going to shove it down my throat an make me believe that two men or women spooning is a natural occurrence”

The truth at 11:55AM (comment 192): “…and I don’t care who mates with what. I just don’t want it to disrupt my life. If all of humanity did what felt goof to them and not good for them where would we be?”

The truth at 1:04PM (comment 214): “even with a vasectomy he is still a man! A MAN who has made a choice to live with a WOMAN and NOT have children, that is called PLANNED PARENTHOOD”

WHAT?!?

Jun. 08 2009 01:34 PM
Yvonne from Brooklyn, New York

At the time that my mother (a Catholic) married my father (a Methodist/Hindu), the Catholic Church did not recognize marriage between Catholics and non-Catholics and refused to marry them but the state did recognize such a union and my parents had a civil marriage.

If the Catholic perspective had prevailed at the time and had been the only perspective, my parents would not have been able to marry.

Christians have a right to define who is eligible for a religious ceremony within their faith but they have no right to dictate to others outside their faith. This country is founded on the separation of church and state.

As for the argument that marriage is for procreation only and homosexuals cannot procreate, such perspectives emerged out of a time of high death rates for both infant/toddlers and of mothers in childbirth and are destructive in the times of better medical care and over-population. A man and woman have a right to marry and, by choice, not have children.

The argument that homosexuality is not natural is easily refuted by anthropologists and observers of animals. It has always existed, if only as a secondary option, and, in some cultures, had a built in and accepted role ... in one culture I have read about, as a rite of passage all boys went through with elders/mentors.

It is interesting to note that the prohibitions I have been able to find in the bible address only sex between men and ignore sex between women.

Jun. 08 2009 01:31 PM
the truth from bkny

HJS, quitters another minority group right? well you should give up if you hear "hate" in my opionions.

Jun. 08 2009 01:22 PM
hjs from 11211

truth
"Most gay people were sexually molested or abused."
where are u getting that? sounds like most black people ____ (fill in racist stereotype)

both are equally true

u win i give up. hate always wins

Jun. 08 2009 01:07 PM
the truth from bkny

Exactly, that is how he was able to represent the bronx, he probably received 2 votes total.

Jun. 08 2009 01:05 PM
the truth from bkny

HJS - even with a vasectomy he is still a man! A MAN who has made a choice to live with a WOMAN and NOT have children, that is called PLANNED PARENTHOOD.

No one wants to deny gays the "basic" human rights, everyone should absolutely be treated fairly in the eyes of the law, so here it is again for the slow people:

GRANT CIVIL UNIONS FOR GAYS!!!!!

Jun. 08 2009 01:04 PM
Matt

Manhattanites are always shocked when they are confronted with the reality of Bronx public discourse. Go to any community board meeting in the borough and listen in. The Rev. Díaz's inability to articulate a recognizable paragraph is par for the course.

Jun. 08 2009 01:00 PM
hjs from 11211

truth
is it also your position that men who have had vasectomies can not marry a woman?
explain to the innocent? u can't make gay people disappear by denying them basic human rights. they are still there being gay so if ur innocent asks answer them the same way if they are married or not married?
u don't have to explain to me. but if you are going to protest shouldn't you be able to defend your bigotry? I mean if u can't stand up and explain it maybe it's just a fear u have with no justification.
by the way should left handed people be burned at the stake again. after all there's something very strange about people who can write with their left hand.

Jun. 08 2009 01:00 PM
Tony Davis from Brooklyn, New York

More than 200 comments from WNYC listeners and only one from the Bronx.

Please forgive me if I am making too much of this, but it strikes me that Sen. Diaz's district may be as isolated as a rural community in Mississippi. I find this sad and I think that it reflects poorly on the rest of us New Yorkers.

Jun. 08 2009 12:57 PM
the truth from bkny

VOTER: are you on drugs? Don't mix my responses with other people's responses.

I have said over and over, grant the civil unions, this is all about insurance benefits anyways.

Most gay people were sexually molested or abused.

Religion has nothing to do with any of this, I just answered your what if question, which I realize now was a big mistake.

You should join up with Pete and get a two for one at the psychologist's!

Jun. 08 2009 12:55 PM
Voter from Brooklyn

#202 (the Truth),
So…. Let me see if I’ve got this right… “Choose” your sexuality (even though everyone who claims it is a choice swears it was never a choice for them) and you shouldn’t be allowed to enter into a legal contract with another willing adult going counter to roughly four Constitutional amendments. Chose your religion so you can get you some (converting for marriage), because your old one was too hard (you like pork, eat shell fish, wear mixed fibers, don’t want to be an obedient slave, nor do you want to be your husband’s property) or because it just feel right, thereby toying around with the ultimate fate of your mortal soul, and no big deal…. Government should bend over backwards for the latter choice because of the First Amendment? Same-sex couples monogamously “spooning” is more of a hazard to this country than laissez-faire attitude when it comes to our citizen’s mortal souls? WOW.

And on procreation, ok… don’t explain yourself, Senator Diaz didn’t either, on what to do about all of the HETEROSEXUAL couples who either refuse to procreate or have no hopes of ever being able to procreate but still want to get married. Guess it allows you to say whatever pops into your head without having to think about what you are saying.

Jun. 08 2009 12:50 PM
hjs from 11211

Yvonne
so then u want to be ur husband's property? slavery should be legal? u don't eat pork or seafood? u don't mix fibers?
on the other hand we don't live in a theocracy, if we did which church should be follow? are u ok with the pope running ur life?

Jun. 08 2009 12:42 PM
the truth from bkny

VOTER/HJS: I don't have to explain anything to you that is also my right but here are a few.

The main thing is that you cannot procreate.

It offends me personally that people want to attach a legal name to this abomination.

It is not conducive to the survival of the human species to have two of the same sex mating, it is not a natural occurence it is abnormal like the defective gene that causes sickle cell.

I dread explaining to the young innocent why it is that two people of the same sex are being intimate, as even to the young it makes no sense.

It is defeneded as one would a race of people which it is not, never seen it on a job app. have you?

Jun. 08 2009 12:40 PM
Yvonne from Brooklyn, New York

Either the bible is the word of god or it isn't and, if it is the word of god, Christians should follow every word equally not cherry pick what suits them.

Yes, Leviticus states that "thou shall not lie with mankind as with womankind" but it also forbids the wearing of mixed fibers of diverse type such as wool and linen (also forbidden in Deuteronomy), eating pork and shrimp (but beetles are OK), cutting of sideburns and trimming of beards, sale of food for profit, sex during the menstrual cycle, cross breeding of crops (no tangelos), etc..

So what is most pleasing to god?? Given the number of words devoted to it, animal sacrifice tops everything even adherence to the ten commandments. Also, Deuteronomy states that, at the end of every seven years, you must cancel your debts!

Jun. 08 2009 12:31 PM
Voter from Brooklyn

Truth,
Even if it were a metaphor, you’ve avoided answering any questions, not unlike Senator Diaz, on how this issue specifically affects you. How does two people of the same sex “spooning” in a monogamous state recognized relationship disrupt your life? How does the lack of procreation by other couples disrupt your life?
You, like Senator Diaz, seem perfectly happy to deny the 14th Amendment rights of others out of the incorrect perception that it will disrupt YOUR life.

Jun. 08 2009 12:31 PM
Marty Wolfe from Brooklyn

Brian, I happen to agree with Diaz's conclusion, though I totally didn't understand his arguments. You may disagree with him, and find flaws in his arguments. But you're on the radio, and I imagined that you generally try to be unbiased when talking to guests. I respected you for that. I have lost that respect.
Your job, I thought, was to allow your guests to present their views, not for you to present yours.

Jun. 08 2009 12:30 PM
hjs from 11211

peter
i never say uncle. i wasn't talking about except to reply to DB.

truth
guess u haven't thought fthis out fully maybe next time. thanks

Jun. 08 2009 12:26 PM
the truth from bkny

VOTER - the bigger choice would be sexuality. Your religion is also a preference, you can choose NOT to be Catholic, Baptist, etc...oh and people do.

Jun. 08 2009 12:16 PM
Peter from Sunset Park

hjs, I think, in your own hjs way, you just said "uncle." Nice sweety. Again, very odd that you bring up the Palestinians during a topic of gay rights. I guess the WNYC censors just don't have any policies at all when it comes to liberal posters. Us center guys have to be more careful. Until later honey.

Jun. 08 2009 12:16 PM
jim fouratt from west village

listening to six people talk against this environmentally sound and resident sensitive proposal. I live in the West Village on Waverly and West 11th. My neighborhood is highly impacted by the vehicles driven by St Vincent's employees who monopolize all most all the non-metered parking slots in my neighborhood. I know they worked for St Vincents because they sit in their vehicles for an hour or more (I assume when they are being paid to work) waiting for the Street cleaning time limits to be met. It is a nightmare 24/7. Middle class resident who still have cars and who can not afford the $600 + parking garage fees can not find parking spaces because of this invasion of St Vincent employee cars. Parking permits is a good solution for residents. St Vincent's does have a parking garage for some of its professional staff it should have a public transportation education campaign for workers and added incentives like discounted metro passes. If people use public transportation everyone benefits, residents, visitors, workers and the environment... and the guy on 15th street should think a little deeper on this issue. I no longer have a car.

Jun. 08 2009 12:15 PM
the truth from bkny

HJS, apples and oranges and spooning was just a polite metaphor, get that out of your head.

Jun. 08 2009 12:11 PM
hjs from 11211

peter
just cause arabs don't respect the human right of gays doesn't give me the right to kill them. after 80 years of europe and the US supporting arab dictators clearly arab society needs many reforms, women also have no rights. but let's not mix figs and olives

Jun. 08 2009 12:10 PM
Chris from New York

I was on my way to work when I heard this interview with Diaz. HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE! What a disgrace. This guy is Democrat?!? I'm certain the only reason he claimed to be a democrat was to get the vote. He stands for EVERYTHING Republican!! What a phony! He really needs to go back to church and repent. He is promoting hatred & intolerance.

Jun. 08 2009 12:06 PM
hjs from 11211

truth
how does it disrupt your life? why such interest in who is spooning who, why think about that??

further what about divorce do u support outlawing divorce, seems bad for the kids. so persons with kids should not be allowed
to divorce just cause it "felt good to them"

Jun. 08 2009 12:05 PM
Peter from Sunset Park

hjs,

I am surprised that you would bring up the Palestinians in this thread. But since you are ultra liberal, the WNYC censors won't delete your comments - you have nothing to worry about. I wonder how Palestinian society treats gays as compared to Israeli society?

As always, great chatting with you honey.

Jun. 08 2009 12:01 PM
Voter from Brooklyn

The Truth,
IF (and that is a huge IF) sexuality is a preference, as you believe, and not natural in the same sense as, let’s say handiness, what do you feel is a bigger choice… Sexuality or Religion?
Religious conservatives seem to go out of their way to tie “preference” to matters of sexuality, followed by “but I could never choose to be gay”. A bit of an oxymoron. But, when it comes to religion… talk about a choice! An evangelical minister, raised atheist choose to become Christian… An uncircumcised male gets circumcised and converts to marry his beloved… Catholics becoming Episcopalians…
You speak as if sexuality is fluid, what should we do to reign in the fluidity of religion? Seems like people believe whatever denomination suits them at the moment. Sounds like that does more to hurt your view of society than same-sex civil unions.

Jun. 08 2009 11:57 AM
the truth from bkny

HJS, preference is not a legal defense.

Jun. 08 2009 11:56 AM
the truth from bkny

HJS...I said men AND women, and I don't care who mates with what. I just don't want it to disrupt my life.

If all of humanity did what felt good to them and not good for them where would we be?

Jun. 08 2009 11:55 AM
Edward from NJ

Ruben Diaz is clearly not a WNYC fan.

Here's his Facebook status:

My radio interview this morning on WNYC's Brian Lehrer Show has moved to 10:00. Tune in to 93.5 FM or listen live online at www.wnyc.com .

Jun. 08 2009 11:51 AM
hjs from 11211

db
we are not fighting today. but thanks for ur concern. (we only disagree when it comes to the ethnic cleansing of palestinians)

Jun. 08 2009 11:46 AM
Tom from UWS

Tamara, certainly many of Sen Diaz's constituents do care about the issue (and that goes for gay people living in the S Bronx, too!)

We can bet that many religious leaders are devoting time to the question on Sunday and putting the scare into many who are not frightened already. The fact that advertisements are appearing on NYC television warning of the DANGERS of same-sex marriage is evidence enough that for some folks, stirring up fear is part of earning their daily bread: keep your base nervous, so they keep up the donations. (And, yes, groups on the left know how to do this, too.)

You don't get those checks being reasonable.

Jun. 08 2009 11:44 AM
db from nyc

Peter from Sunset Park and hjs from 11211, please kiss and make-up! Or at least grow-up, the issue deserves more intelligent debate. You're wasting digital characters.

Jun. 08 2009 11:43 AM
moviemouth from Manhattan

Brian, when confronted with the "abortion is the murder of innocent life" argument, why not just ask what your guest's position is on fertility treament? When the infertile want to give birth, dozens of embryos (life) are created most of which will eventually be destroyed (murdered).

This is inconsistent reasoning and the reason for skipping over it is that Americans (especially women) believe they have a divine (and politically sacred)right to conceive and raise their own biological children which is as politically charged as the right to bear arms and to own dogs (actually more so since it is supported by both pro-life and pro-choice advocates.

Jun. 08 2009 11:41 AM
Tom from UWS

natural?

There are no written contracts in nature.

For most of human history, "marriage" has been far more concerned with property and labor, inheritance and social welfare (each subsequent generation caring for the previous one in old age) than with anything else, especially our modern notions of love and affection.

If marriage is GOOD for two people, then it is good for two people of the same sex who perceive that good. If not, we really should look for another paradigm.

Jun. 08 2009 11:39 AM
hjs from 11211

peter
no one who can read would ever think you are innocent. stop playing the victim.

Jun. 08 2009 11:38 AM
Tony Davis from Brooklyn, New York

175 comments from listeners and only one from the Bronx.

I wonder if WNYC could so some outreach to our fellow New Yorkers in the Bronx so as to bring more Bronx residents into the larger NYC political dialogue!

Jun. 08 2009 11:38 AM
BL Show from WNYC Studios

Folks -
Please remember the WNYC posting policy. Refrain from personal attacks, and keep the conversation productive to the discussion that took place on the air. Thanks, and thanks for listening,
-BL Show-

Jun. 08 2009 11:36 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

HJS,

Sugar, when you are right, you are right!

Truth wrote,

"Peter, seek mental help." Wow, amazing that I get censored all the time at WNYC for posting polite political views that get instantly deleted by knee jerk liberals. Yet Truth gets away with crazy stuff. Man, these WNYC censors are interesting people.

Jun. 08 2009 11:34 AM
hjs from 11211

truth,
i don't care what u want shoved down your throat that's up to you. stop thinking about men spooning and this should have no effect on your life unless you're ready to change your PREFERENCE?

Jun. 08 2009 11:32 AM
Tamara from astoria

Listening to Senator Diaz made me both laugh and foam at the mouth. HOW is this man a Senator?!?!?!? His inability to grasp the real issue is stunning. His desire to enforce his religious beliefs on the rest of us is disgusting, and shows that he doesn't really understand his job, or the Constitution. It makes me want to move to the Bronx just to be able to vote for whoever opposes him!! Maybe I should funnel my energy into contributing to his opponant and working for their election?

I find it hard-- no-- impossible to believe that his constituants want or need him to spend his time on who gets married. Perhaps he should consider working tirelessly for more funding for his school districts? Job training? After school programs? Something that will have a tangible effect on their lives?

Jun. 08 2009 11:30 AM
hjs from 11211

peter
thanks sugar!

Jun. 08 2009 11:27 AM
hjs from 11211

truth
and IF this is about "preference" so what. why should you care who gets married?
and don't say u don't care cause this is an issue that always gets u typing.

Jun. 08 2009 11:25 AM
the truth from bkny

Peter, seek mental help.

This is about sexual preference, but no one is going to shove it down my throat and make me believe that two men or women spooning is a natural occurence!

Jun. 08 2009 11:23 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

hjs,

that is your greatest post ever, nice way to put this issue in a historical perspective. Nice post honey.

Jun. 08 2009 11:21 AM
Moshe Feder from Flushing, NY

Brian, thanks for your tough questioning of Senator Diaz.

He quickly revealed himself as the embarrassment to his community and our state government that he is. I hope some people's eyes were opened.

Keep up the good work!

Jun. 08 2009 11:18 AM
hjs from 11211

when i was young, in the 80's, the reason for hating gay people was that they (men) were too promiscuous. so now some want to marry, have families and be part of the mainstream and still they are not accepted. I guess I'll never understand why people care what other people are doing in their beds. some people will always want to oppress others, I guess the gays are just one of the last groups left to single out for special consideration.

Jun. 08 2009 11:18 AM
hjs from 11211

when i was young, in the 80's, the reason for hating gay people was that they (men) were too promiscuous. so now some want to marry, have families and be part of the mainstream and still they are not accepted. I guess I'll never understand why people care what other people are doing in their beds. some people will always want to oppress others, I guess the gays are just one of the last groups left to single out for special consideration.

Jun. 08 2009 11:18 AM
mc from Brooklyn

Liam #160:

I am actually with you. I think the state should completely get out of the marriage business. Problem is, that train has already left the station. I don't see that changing.

Jun. 08 2009 11:12 AM
Tom from UWS

Liam, considering the large number of gay activists who are white males, you shouldn't feel picked on, now or in the future!
One of them, Tom

BTW, the reference to inter-racial marriage is perfectly legitimate: it points out that marriage law HAS changed over the years (not to mention marriage custom.) Moreover, consider the case of Loving vs. Virginia, the one that put and end to miscegenation laws across the country. The Lovings were arrested by officers who broke into their own home and found them in bed together.

To those who find this issue to marginal to discuss in times of "economic stress", please note how many hours of programming WNYC and NPR devote to the economy on a daily basis! And remember that hard economic times are no justification for an end to progress - if anything they justify serious thought about myriad issues that have been shuffled to the back burner year after year.

Jun. 08 2009 11:12 AM
Voter from Brooklyn

True, the Truth from Brooklyn (102), Same sex couples cannot procreate (with each other). However, neither can elderly newlyweds… why should the old and crusty be wed, they aren’t helping to further society. Cancer survivors get married all the time… even ones who had testicular and ovarian cancer and can no longer reproduce. Why should we let them get married, what are they doing for us? The naturally infertile (I suppose they could go to the fertility clinic to have frankebabies, but wouldn’t that be playing God? I mean, it’s no different from going to the abortion clinic to play God and kill babies…) get married, but what for? Maybe it’s God’s way of saying he doesn’t condone. Couples who have a child or their children precede them in death, seems like an excellent case for annulment. And then there’s the plain unwilling. Those who do not heed God’s call to be fruitful and multiply should be never be allowed to marry! I mean, if secular state-performed and state-recognized unions are only for procreation then our national laws should reflect as much. Do you agree?

Jun. 08 2009 11:11 AM
Kevin from Manhattan

Government can't refuse to allow a person to enter into a contract with another person based on their gender. As far as government's concerned, that's what marriage is.

To those who argue that marriage is a religious ceremony or status, then fine: but if that's the case, then government has no business being involved, and everyone should have civil unions issued by government and get "married" in whatever church you choose.

Jun. 08 2009 11:10 AM
the truth from bkny

DARK, their civil rights are not being violated due to their race or religion, this is an issue of sexual preference!

Jun. 08 2009 11:09 AM
John from Bklyn

"Reverend" Senator! There's your problem right there. Why can't he pick one career and stick to it? Keep church and state SEPARATE. EQUAL RIGHTS for ALL!!!!

Jun. 08 2009 11:08 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

Lynn,

Please provide a single dismissive example. Thanks honey.

Jun. 08 2009 11:07 AM
Dave K from Brooklyn

Thank you Commenter's # 38 and 62 and the BL Show. I listened to the entire interview with Diaz but I am only commenting now because I've been outside screaming at the top of my lungs since it's completion. Diaz really sounded inarticulate and bigoted. Can't wait for the interview to be posted on-line so I can send it to all my friends for a good (albeit sad) laugh.

Jun. 08 2009 11:03 AM
mc from Brooklyn

"truth" (bklyn, atlanta??) #140. Correct. It is about equality.

Jun. 08 2009 11:01 AM
Gladys from Weehawken NJ

PS Re Diaz :
Are language, IQ or sobriety tests prerequisites for running for office?

May any moron or lunatic apply?

Heaven help us!

Jun. 08 2009 10:59 AM
Tom from UWS

Precious few comments about the 2nd half of the segment! Here's mine.
To the caller from Staten Island, it is absolutely a fact that although ministers and rabbis, boat captains and others are authorized by the state to perform legal marriage, they are not required to. More to the point, no religious official is required by the state to perform any of the rites of their faith for anyone they deem ineligible according to their rules. A Catholic priest is perfectly free to decline the sacrament of matrimony to a non-catholic, for instance, or for that matter to a catholic who he feels is undeserving of the sacrament. (State of sin, for instance.)

It is a great treasure to live in a nation where the government does not write the laws of the churches, and we should protect that. We should also protect the civil code from the churchmen who would rewrite it in the form of dogma.

As to the possibility that same-sex marriage would "open the door" to marriage between parent and (adult) child or between a human and an animal or between three adults, we must be crystal clear: same-sex marriage is about equality before the law. Marriage benefits and responsibilities are based on a legal contract that is limited by statute to two participants. It's one of the simplest of legal contracts, and the issue is whether it is defensible to have a contract with significant social benefits that requires the two parties must be of the opposite sex. REmember, this contract doesn't require that the parties know one another or plan to procreate or have equal financial investment or anything of the like. It requires the parties to promise exclusivity and support.

From civic and social viewpoints, it can only be a good thing for our society and country to extend marriage to same sex couples. Rather than threaten marriage, it should be cause for all couples - married or not - to recconsider their commitment and the worth of the marriage contract.
Tom Crisp

Jun. 08 2009 10:59 AM
Lynn from Brooklyn

Peter...
I'd argue that I see evidence that you're quite accomplished at dismissive language, last seen just minutes ago. I believe that contradicts your complaint...but not your dismissiveness.

Jun. 08 2009 10:58 AM
Liam from East Elmhurst

NOT IMPORTANT!
THIS IS POLI-FOLLY!
THAT IS POLITE LANGUAGE!
No time to be politically correct-take marriage AWAY from government if necessary and let homosexuals find a church or whatever to marry them-I DON'T CARE.
Social unions for everyone-just a legal piece of paper-not here to supply lawyers with work.
I just can't stand these stupid issues being focused on while we sink into the financial abyss.
Guaranteed if this passes, it will be used by the left to inflict something on white males-this is why the Democratic Party (which should get away from the malarky) won't last in office.
P.S. I am a Democrat and I voted for Obama.

Jun. 08 2009 10:52 AM
hjs from 11211

MichaelB
think again. many cultures have different rules for marriage. even today in many parts of the world a man can marry more than one woman.

Jun. 08 2009 10:49 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

The "truth"

Um, civil rights...that's the comparison.

Jun. 08 2009 10:47 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

Truth,

I love the language you liberals get away with at WNYC. Sweety, honey, great stuff! I would never get away with being so dismissive because I am not liberal enough.

Take care sweet honey.

Jun. 08 2009 10:47 AM
Edward from NJ

The only arguments against marriage equality seem to be abstract religious discomfort or slippery-slope straw men. Perhaps this is why conservatives who don't pander to the religious right -- Ted Olsen, Dick Cheney -- are increasingly coming out in favor of it.

Jun. 08 2009 10:47 AM
paul from nyc

would Diaz be in favor of immigration if it did not involve
Catholic Hispanics?

and perhaps he would not oppose gay marriage if it did not involve homosexuals.

Jun. 08 2009 10:46 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

Liam-

"Let's change our culture for the few"

Soooo...I guess you support legal segregation and slavery then? The abolition of both changed culture for the relatively few

It's called progress, look it up!

Jun. 08 2009 10:46 AM
Justin from Sarasota, Florida

I am a devout Christian - and in response to Brian's recent question, I believe that civil marriage and spiritual marriage are different issues.

I do not believe in gay marriage from a religious perspective, however, if the justice of the peace wishes to give out a marriage certificate from a stricly legal perspective, it does not offend me.

I was married by a Pastor who was close to our family, but not yet ordained, therefore, could not sign a marriage certificate. Our marriage certificate was signed by a justice of the peace, but our wedding ceremony was sanctioned by the pastor in a private setting. To me, the legal certificate has little meaning except for taxes, it is the vows and commitment my wife and I made to each other that holds authority for us.

I appreciate the recent caller's comment on whether priests/pastors who do not believe homosexual marriage is right, will be forced to either give up their legal authorization to conduct weddings, simply because they do not wish to conduct homosexual weddings.

Good discussion.

Jun. 08 2009 10:43 AM
the truth from bkny

Peter, have at it honey

Jun. 08 2009 10:42 AM
LOOK IT UP

MARRIAGE BETWEEN FAMILY MEMBERS IS PERFECTLY LEGAL IN MANY U.S. CHURCHES--SO LONG AS THE GENDERS ARE OPPOSITE.

Jun. 08 2009 10:41 AM
hjs from 11211

truth
you're right it's only about human rights. why would anyone care who marries who

Jun. 08 2009 10:41 AM
Liam from East Elmhurst

How come the black people can be used by this lady, but, the other's couldn't mention the Holocaust?
Yep, I can see FAIR AND BALANCED going out the window here.
Let's change our culture for the few. Especially, if it secures a block of votes for these Democrats who can see the NEO-Cons on the rise based on this one issue.
Hey, we got rid of Bush-get this crappy issue out of here-NOT IMPORTANT! NOT IMPORTANT! NOT WANTED BY MOST PEOPLE!

Jun. 08 2009 10:41 AM
Rupert Cadell from brooklyn

Bob (caller):

I totally get it now! What if we all just were like marrying trees and cars and the sun? What would happen then? What about the children?

Jun. 08 2009 10:40 AM
Katie Kennedy from Huntington, NY

Catholic Priests refuse to marry people all the time--because they're divorced or because one is Jewish, whatever. That was a silly argument.

Jun. 08 2009 10:40 AM
Gladys Carbo Flower from Weehawken NJ

Ruben Diaz is a perfect example of why the term
"Hispanic" must be abolished. It's a mistake to lump all Spanish speaking peoples - this man bears no similarity to Cuban Americans (my heritage) I or to any number of other groups who come from Spain and other Latin American countries. Diaz is equally monosyllabic in Spanish....guaranteed. He is an embarassment to the Spanish language and to thoughtful and intelligent people everywhere.

Jun. 08 2009 10:40 AM
MichaelB from Morningside Heights

The caller brings up a very good point and the Senator's answer doesn't cover it. 2nd marriages by Catholic priests is not a good analogy, because there isn't the same context for a lawsuit.

Also, comparisons to not allowing interracial marriage is not the same: one recent, borne out of ethnic prejudcies, the other universal and as old as history and pre-history.

Jun. 08 2009 10:40 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

Truth,

I figure, if you can call people Sweety, I can too. Thanks for sharing Sweety.

Jun. 08 2009 10:40 AM
Ed from Brooklyn

The US Constitution protects churches from marrying anyone that they feel should not be married on theological grounds. It is the same thing that (in theory) protects me from them. It is the First Amendment.

And really, religious marriage is only theater. The binding contract is civil.

Jun. 08 2009 10:40 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

"child" and "elderly" refer to age...marriage is an act and contract

duh

Jun. 08 2009 10:39 AM
Louis from Asbury Park

I have always felt the argument gay maraiage threatens churches who do not want to marry gays is not valid. I wish more would argue this is about FULL LEGAL RIGHTS for all. European countries all marriages get full legal rights & then couples go to church of choice which will marry them if the couple so chooses to do so.

Jun. 08 2009 10:39 AM
the truth from bkny

Why is this woman talking about marriage between races? The two issues are NOT comparable.

Jun. 08 2009 10:39 AM
anon from brooklyn

Wow-- WNYC scraping the barrel of lowest common denominator today-- I am getting flashbacks of growing up in TN...

Jun. 08 2009 10:39 AM
Smokey from LES

How can we have marriage state by state? Imagine if we treated driver licenses that way!

Jun. 08 2009 10:38 AM
Hugh from Brookyn

Again, to everyone who had to suffer through the bigot Diaz, you can contact his office. You can support anyone opposing him.

Albany phone: (518) 455-2511

And his Facebook page takes comments:

http://www.facebook.com/people/Ruben-Diaz/1136664622#/profile.php?id=1136664622

Jun. 08 2009 10:38 AM
meagan from manhattan

you know, clergy refuse to marry straight people all the time! why all this worry that they won't be able to refuse a wedding they don't want to do?

Jun. 08 2009 10:38 AM
the truth from bkny

This is NOT about RELIGION or RACE!

Jun. 08 2009 10:36 AM
Hugh from Brookyn

Sen. Diaz's contact info:

District Office
1733 East 172nd Street
Bronx, NY 10472
Tel: (718) 991-3161 / Fax: (718) 991-0309

Albany Office
307 Legislative Office Building
Albany, NY 12247
Tel: (518) 455-2511 / Fax: (518) 426-6945

He also has a Facebook page:

http://www.facebook.com/people/Ruben-Diaz/1136664622#/profile.php?id=1136664622

Jun. 08 2009 10:34 AM
Dorothy from Manhattan

This "gentleman" should have a look at this gay couple raising baby abandoned by its parents.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Good_News/2009/06/04/9678691-ap.html

Jun. 08 2009 10:34 AM
SuzanneNYC from Upper West Side

There are five Catholics currently on the Supreme Court. No wonder they turned back DADT. With Sotomayor there will be six. While I think she'll be a great judge for other reasons, I'm concerned at this imbalance. I hope it will be adjusted as new appointments are made.

Jun. 08 2009 10:32 AM
the truth from bkny

Give the gay people their civil unions so that they can get the benefits they seek. Insurance coverage, beneficiary rights, the ability to visit in the ICU etc...

Jun. 08 2009 10:32 AM
Dan from Highland Park, NJ

According to Diaz, the purpose of marriage is to procreate, and because a homosexual couple can't have children naturally, they shouldn't be entitled to be married.

So the question is, what about heterosexual couples that can't have children, heterosexual couples that don't plan to have children, and heterosexual couples that need to resort to processes like IVF to conceive?

I doubt Diaz would refuse to marry an elderly heterosexual couple that found love late in life, a young couple that had no plans to have kids, or a couple that might in the future have conception issues.

This is just another illogical argument against gay marriage, a legal contract that should have nothing to whether you believe in God or not.

Jun. 08 2009 10:32 AM
kamal from Bronx

Diaz and his 99% vote is a great example of people voting race vs. qualifications.

Maybe a Latina is wiser than a white man, but this Latino ain't.

Jun. 08 2009 10:32 AM
Louis from Asbury Park

THANK YOU Sen Krueger. I wish every politican -obama included- woud frame the debate, & use the language she just used regarding Gay marriage issue. Bravo. Listen up all you politicans! ,

Jun. 08 2009 10:32 AM
richard hokin from darien ct

If every gay couple in the United States were to marry, what portion of the total population would that represent? How can we waste time, energy, money and brain cells on this topic when our economy is in the tank; when we have colossal environmental issues; and when geopolitical instability and threats are rampant?

Jun. 08 2009 10:31 AM
Karen from Westchester

Pls discuss these benefits for married couples in NYS. I only know of tax liabilities.

Jun. 08 2009 10:31 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

Highest respect for Diaz?

So she respects his right to fight to deny other people's rights??? WTF?

Stop with the PC nonsense! One should NEVER "respect" the "right" of someone else to try and deny the rights of others. That just makes no sense.

Jun. 08 2009 10:31 AM
Connor Coffey from Brooklyn

Brian, since we are referencing the Bible - you embody the patience of Job in your questioning of Sen. Ruben Diaz. How you are able to maintain your composure when speaking to such an irretrievably ignorant fool is beyond my comprehension. I suppose that's a majr component of why you're so good at what you do - keep it up!

Jun. 08 2009 10:30 AM
Jason Jaksetic from NJ

This man is a caricature, right? He is so completely irrational and ridiculous that he has to be an actor, not an elected official. That he is a real politician would be too shameful to bare.

Jun. 08 2009 10:29 AM
ariel from crown heights

I just wish Diaz were a better debate-opponent...Please have more intelligent, coherent and worthy debaters in future, to give this issue the full depth/scope of conversation it surely deserves.

Plus, it sounds so weird to quote the bible on wnyc in 2009 and use that book as moral compass - have people actually read ALL the rules in that thing??

Jun. 08 2009 10:29 AM
Erica P. from NJ (in exsilium)

I echo so many others' reactions. This guy is an elected State Senator?!?

I am completely flabbergasted. I thought I was cynical enough for these times. Perhaps the problem is that Diaz is stuck hopelessly in the embarrassing past?

Jun. 08 2009 10:29 AM
db from nyc

The highest respect for this idiot, Diaz??? Give me a BREAK Liz!!!!

Jun. 08 2009 10:28 AM
George from Brooklyn

Brian, Thank you so much for letting Diaz dig his own grave there. I am supremely embarrassed that he is a state senator.
I hate to be so blunt, but he seems kind of like an idiot.
Didn't realize he was such a religious zealot who was taking his beliefs into the legislature.

Jun. 08 2009 10:28 AM
Darrell Silver from Lower Manhattan

Asking an elected official to justify his position in relation to slavery does not show any respect for the voters that put him in office.

We may not like what Diaz has to say, and he has a record of sensationalist statements, but he *is* a spokesman for the people of the South Bronx.

Opinions on gay marriage are personal, and as Lehrer points out, fluid. Opponents are common and often private. The only way to sway opinion is to respect the arguments and appeal to equality.

This interview is on the air right now, and has moved into a long discussion of abortion and Hitler. Will anyone not become more polarized as a result?

Jun. 08 2009 10:28 AM
Emily Joyce from UES

I pity Senator Diaz. He is the one of the most conflicted political leaders I have ever heard. It's quite sad, actually. Maybe he should take a long break from public life and spend some time searching his own soul.

Brian, amazing job grilling this guy. I am predicting a very short career for him.

Jun. 08 2009 10:28 AM
Marleny from Harlem

I am so ashamed. So ashamed.

Jun. 08 2009 10:27 AM
David from Bklyn

The cutlural conservativism exemplified by Mr. Diaz seems to me to be a good reason to be cautious about liberalizing immigration laws.

Jun. 08 2009 10:27 AM
Diana from NYC

I wonder what this senator´s idea of nature is. It´s natural for lions to kill their offspring. It´s natural for certain spiders to kill the males while mating.

Jun. 08 2009 10:27 AM
Danielle from Greenpoint

How do people like this guy get elected?
He was incapable of stringing together a comprehensible thought.
I'm reminded of the idiocy that is our democracy after listening to State Senator Diaz.

Jun. 08 2009 10:27 AM
CD

Can you say Crash and Burn? Thank you Brian for exposing Ruben Diaz for what he really is; a idiotic, hypocritical bigot.

Jun. 08 2009 10:26 AM
the truth from bkny

Shared parenting = single parenting. One of the partners will certainly NOT be included in the creation of the child, thus invoving a third party. All you are doing is confusing the natural order of the birthing process, how can you all not see that this is unnatural?

Jun. 08 2009 10:26 AM
Selectamickey from brooklyn

what was he on about the legislature? would he like a plebiscite? why on this issue and not on god-knows how many others?

Jun. 08 2009 10:26 AM
MichaelB from Morningside Heights

Whether you believe in gay marriage or not, what do you mean, Brian by "and that's it?"

Since when is nature to be so casually dismissed? Why, do you know of more profound things in our world?

Jun. 08 2009 10:26 AM
db from nyc

Married gay couples can adopt and care for some of the children that result from no abortions!!!

Jun. 08 2009 10:26 AM
Darius from Prospect Heights

Wow, so even if you're straight and can't have children you shouldn't be able to get married according to Diaz. What a maniac.

Jun. 08 2009 10:25 AM
Jason from Midtown

i just threw up in my mouth.

Jun. 08 2009 10:25 AM
antonio from park slope

It would be great if they had another guest to balance the senator...
I really can't believe these primitive ideas the senator is citing..

Jun. 08 2009 10:25 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

#85

EXCUSE me? The Bronx is big. That statementis just as ridiculous as judging all of Brooklyn on the views of one idiot.

Jun. 08 2009 10:25 AM
Danielle from Greenpoint

I can't believe that this guy is a state senator. How do people like this get elected?
He is completely incapable of stringing together a comprehensible thought.

Jun. 08 2009 10:25 AM
the truth from bkny

I can see why Brian may seem powerful in this discussion, because the gentleman is unable to articulate himself in english but, that is the truth he just spoke their.

Same sexes cannot pro-create.

Jun. 08 2009 10:24 AM
Jack from Brooklyn

Ruben Diaz is such a weasel here. Even if you were pro-life, this guy is an embarrassment. He's just a cowardly patronizing embarrassment.

Whoever thinks NYC is filled liberals needs to only listen to this clown for five seconds.

This guy is wretched.

Jun. 08 2009 10:24 AM
Jessie from Rye

You know what else Hitler did? Ordered research into fertility treatment/genetic engineering. Perhaps we should also start murdering doctors specializing in fertility treatment. They ARE playing with precious lives (Octomom?!).

Pro-lifers need to come up with better arguments.

Jun. 08 2009 10:24 AM
christa from jersey city

"during the war time, everything is legal..."

i hope i can download this as a podcast and turn it into a drinking game. this is hilarious but also very, very disturbing.

Jun. 08 2009 10:24 AM
GREAT GUEST

He's pulling your leg Brian!

Jun. 08 2009 10:24 AM
Nina from East Village

This is painful. I'm as on-the-left as you can be on the issue of gay marriage, but I'm sorry, English proficiency should be a requirement for public office.

Jun. 08 2009 10:24 AM
Steve from Brooklyn

Wow this guy is super ignorant!

Jun. 08 2009 10:23 AM
maria from bklyn

Most Latinos are still colonized. They are still confined by the Catholic church and other antiquated belief systems.

After all that Puerto Ricans endured in this nation, specially in New York City, how can this man speak in such way? How can this man hold such prejudice and stand in the way for others to experience freedom and quality of life that him and his family before him came to this country for?

Jun. 08 2009 10:23 AM
Rupert Cadell from brooklyn

"Everything is legal. Everything is proper...during wartime." HAHA!

Jun. 08 2009 10:23 AM
Selectamickey from brooklyn

keep on with the logical argument Brian, don't let him off.....I'll be kind and just say he's extremely poorly prepared.

Jun. 08 2009 10:23 AM
Lynn Brown from Brooklyn

With all due respect...if Mr. Diaz's faith is so weak as to be shaken by allowing two people to commit to a relationship, I suggest he reexamine his faith. If he is hurt by granting other people rights, I pity him. If he is actually going to invoke Hitler, his offense to the law of the land is beneath contempt. He is displaying the most irresponsible actions of leadership. I can no longer take ANYTHING this man says seriously.

Jun. 08 2009 10:23 AM
SuzanneNYC from Upper West Side

This is why we have separation of church and state. When a religious person is in a position to legislate, this line becomes blurred in disastrous ways. As we see now.

Jun. 08 2009 10:23 AM
Hugh from Brookyn

I disagree with Johnny S -- this guy isn't pandering: He really believes the vile nonsense he is puking out.

Many many thanks to Maria from Brooklyn for speaking for Puerto Ricans who endorse justice.

Jun. 08 2009 10:23 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

#68

Excellent point. Wish Brian would ask him about that.

Jun. 08 2009 10:22 AM
the truth from bkny

"This guy" represents the community that voted him into office.

Jun. 08 2009 10:22 AM
Jeff from Brooklyn

Most interesting and depressing is that Diaz was VOTED into office and representing a district.

Jun. 08 2009 10:22 AM
Kevin from Manhattan

I think Mr. Diaz mispoke and that he is a New Yorker first and a Puerto Rican by background or birth. He is an embarrassment to either right now in his stubbornness and lack of enlightenment. George Wallace and Huey Long come to mind, just for starters.

Jun. 08 2009 10:22 AM
anon from brooklyn

and now I understand why the Bronx is the way it is...

Jun. 08 2009 10:22 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

I doubt Brian would grill Vice President Biden about his weak abortion views.

Jun. 08 2009 10:22 AM
Melissa from East Village

PLEASE ask this moron what's worse for children: being raised by a 16-year old unmarried girl who drops out of high school or being raised by two adult, educated, high-earning people who really WANT a child?

Jun. 08 2009 10:21 AM
African Depsot Soundin

i'm just tuning in, listening to a man speaking -- NO IDEA who he is and I purposely didn't look at his name...

I am writing because this man is arguing and posturing EXACTLY like an AFRICAN despot. Won't answer questions, self righteous, sounds semi-drunk.

Oh, the name was just mentioned -- Diaz. Mkay...Mr. Diaz, I hope you are having fun--I think I know the answer! I'm laughing where I should but praying you are one of a kind...

Jun. 08 2009 10:21 AM
Jennifer from NYC

I can't listen anymore - this man is sad...

Jun. 08 2009 10:21 AM
the truth from bkny

This again? Vote NO.

Peter you can stop using "sweetie" now, I called you that on Friday and here you are again Monday using the word.

Jun. 08 2009 10:20 AM
Jessie from Rye

The rights of a minority group should NEVER be put to a popular vote. Imagine how slavery would still be around if it was put to a popular vote???

As for Ruben Diaz's comment on the definition of family = Man + Woman + Children...so now we have to have children to be a family???

Jun. 08 2009 10:20 AM
mattt from lic, queens

it's scary to me that this guy diaz represents the district he does. he lacks basic reasoning skills, for pete's sake! he's all over the place...

Jun. 08 2009 10:20 AM
Noah from Brooklyn

Our version of government is meant to protect the minority often over the majority. This is why the Senate has more power than the House. Now I don't agree that this is always correct, but certainly in this case it is correct. How can a person ever be against equal rights?

These people will not be married by Catholic priests they will simply be married by the state not any religious authority. If your religion doesn't want to respect their marriages that is up to them. Most religions already don't respect these people or believe that they make good choices. However religions are not the state.

Jun. 08 2009 10:20 AM
Johnny S

the worst kind of pandering politician

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
Bill from New York

Keep arguing from the Bible, gay marriage opponents, because it serves the pro-argument in the end. The Constitution assures the separation of church and state, which means that whatever the standards it bases policy on, it shouldn't be these vacuous arguments from religion. "Gay Marriage" should be a misnomer; certainly it's a distraction to what matters here: the state should recognize Marriage for no one. You can define it however you want and conduct your ceremonies according to whatever faith you want, and the state shouldn't care. What the state should concern itself with, for gays and straights both, is civil unions only. Civil unions for everyone; marriage out of politics and back in the churches where it belongs.

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
maria from bklyn

I am Puerto Rican and I am ashamed of this man's comments! It is homophobic and prejudice!

What a crying shame to hear his point of view!

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
anon from brooklyn

I cannot believe this idiot is an elected official.

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

#37

yeah, really...WHAT exactly does the bible have to do with any of this anyway? If he wants to live in a theocratic society, I suggest Mr.Diaz move to Tehran...someone remind him this is NEW YORK CITY.

Mr.Diaz, take your bible and get OUT of my city!

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
CD


Ruben Diaz is an absolute disgrace.

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
Hugh from Brookyn

Perhaps Mr. Diaz should reflect on the numbers of Americans who would like to deport people like him for _no other reason_ than his ethnicity.

Mere popular opinion _does not_ trump rights. That is why we have a Bill of Rights.

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
james from caroll gardens

Calling all tech-savvy techno types: Please make a YouTube video out of this! There are so many sound bytes to choose from...

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
Voter from Brooklyn

Senator Diaz,

Speaking of forcing issues down citizens throats, take a quick survey across the country (the whole country) on immigration, especially on Spanish-speaking immigrants. I think it will be eye-opening for you.

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
John from Manhattan

Please get rid of Rubin Diaz in the next election, Brian did such an excellent job in exposing this moron. Gay marriage or not, this guy is an idiot. What constituency is he representing???? He should stop playing the religion card and deal with real issues like the economy! An absolute Moron with the capital M.

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
Michael Cone from Hell's Kitchen

Why should Diaz' beliefs be the law of New York State? How would he feel in a majority Muslim area, would he want to be ruled by their beliefs?

Jun. 08 2009 10:19 AM
Jonathan from sunset park bklyn

This is FAR too painful to listen to. Qué pendejo.

Jun. 08 2009 10:18 AM
gil mann from hoboken

I realize it would be a radical step, but I think it might be time for a constituitional amendment separating church and state.

Jun. 08 2009 10:18 AM
db from nyc

How stupid is the constituency that elected him???!!!

Jun. 08 2009 10:18 AM
Robert

You can send a comment to Ruben Diaz's office here:

http://www.nysenate.gov/senator/ruben-diaz/contact

Jun. 08 2009 10:18 AM
ed campanelli from rego park, queens

i can understand senator diaz's lack of understanding of the constitution, and of appellate jurisprudence, particularly the court of appeals decision in Hernandez v. Robles. but his under appreciation of the bible, and what is says, is breathtaking for a minister.

it is obvious he has not read the constitution, Hernandez, or the bible!

Jun. 08 2009 10:18 AM
Harry from NIMBY

GAY MARRIAGE- WHAT A FARSE; People who are worrying about families and children should seek tougher divorce laws and demand no fault divorce be repealed. The selfish adults with children who divorce and leave a broken family are just as self-centered as the homosexual lobby. Grow-up and be a man or a woman, you can't be both!

Jun. 08 2009 10:18 AM
mc from Brooklyn

As usual, the opponents of equality are unable to come up with a coherent, articulate reason.

Jun. 08 2009 10:18 AM
Ebun from Brooklyn

Can't believe this guy is an elected official, what a tool

Jun. 08 2009 10:18 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

Mike,

You wrote, "I think this guy is a prime example of racism=ignorance." His position on gay marriage isn't any different then President Obama. So it sounds like you are saying President Obama is ignorant. Nice point sweety.

Jun. 08 2009 10:17 AM
Hugh from Brookyn

I have griped about politicians for years and years, and I have NEVER heard any politician sound as stupid, as biased, as revoltingly small-minded and ignorant as this vile little bigot Diaz.

Jun. 08 2009 10:17 AM
Glenn from Union Sq

Who is this guy? Why is someone like him able to get so much power? Does he not realize that there is a separation of church and state?

Jun. 08 2009 10:17 AM
pc from nyc

A state senator! Wow, who voted for him? This is too hard to believe.

Jun. 08 2009 10:17 AM
Nikolai Antonie from Brooklyn

aaaaahhhhhh!! Shut this guy up!!

Jun. 08 2009 10:17 AM
Katie Kennedy from Huntington, NY

Marriage is a civil institution. It becomes a religious institution only after a minister, a rabbi, a priest or some other Church official officiates. Even so, one must have license from the State to marry, therefore, a civil marriage definitely should be allowed. And the Supreme Court's decision not to hear the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" case is an abomination.

Jun. 08 2009 10:17 AM
AY from Soho

I truly feel sorry for his constituents. He is terribly incoherent and makes no sense whatsoever. The people in the Bronx need a stronger advocate.

Jun. 08 2009 10:17 AM
db from nyc

The bible was used to justify slavery, misogyny and a whole host of evil. Pro-slavery frequently cited the Curse of Ham. Not only is this guy an idiot, he's stupid, too!!!

IGNORANT!

Jun. 08 2009 10:16 AM
Edward from NJ

Does Senator Diaz want to prevent gay couples from adopting? I believe that's perfectly legal in New York state and has nothing to do with marriage.

Jun. 08 2009 10:16 AM
Abigail from Brooklyn

I agree with Bernard in his comment--How can this man be an elected official? What a travesty!

Jun. 08 2009 10:16 AM
Jennie from New York, NY

What about seperation of church and state? Diaz believes in the Bible, but not everyone in the state or even his district shares his belief. He should be campaigning within his church to not preform gay marriages, but leave his religious belief at the door when he is acting as Senator. He is obligated to represent everyone in his district not just the religious right.

Jun. 08 2009 10:16 AM
Jennifer from NYC

This is so infuriating to me! This backwards thinking!

Jun. 08 2009 10:16 AM
MichaelB from Morningside Heights

... in fact, following up on my earlier comment, when I went to see my assemblyman Daniel O'Donnell a couple of years ago to ask for his support in the nascent movement for shared parenting, he ANGRILY told me that since he, as a gay man, did not have the right to marry, too bad, no shared parenting.

He didn't want to hear of it.

Jun. 08 2009 10:16 AM
Bo from Brooklyn - Prospect Heights

Let Betty, the World's Best Christian, explain it to him:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFkeKKszXTw

Jun. 08 2009 10:16 AM
Nikolai Antonie from Brooklyn

What is going on here? Thank you Brian for pointing out the contradictions that are flying around this guy's rhetoric. What a closed minded bureaucratic buffoon!

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
Niall Heffernan from Queens

Thank you for exposing this bigot (Ruben Diaz). Too many of these Albany politicians hide behind their unopposed encumbancy.

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
Jonathan from sunset park bklyn

I am speechless at Diaz's mealy-mouthed "arguments."

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
bernard joseph from brooklyn

the ignorant citizens in this guys' district elected him into office. this is a microcosm of the idiotic population of this country as a whole that elected bush TWICE!
on another note, don't you have to have a sort-of-working knowledge of the english language to represent the citizens of our city?

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
Barbara from New York

Diaz is jaw-droppingly ignorant. Wow.

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
Voter from Brooklyn

For a minister, Rubin Diaz seems to forget the Bible condones slavery wholesale. And apparently he doesn’t know what slavery is… forced servitude.
We rail against the Taliban in Swat Valley, Saudi conservatism and the treatment of women, and Ahmadinejad’s speeches, but we’re “ok” with politicians political views in the United States? I suppose religious intolerance and fundamentalism are ok, as long as it isn’t Islam.

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
Barbara Hanson from Manhattan

I respectfully request that Senator Diaz stop waving his all-purpose, bigotry-excusing bible in my face. New York is not a theocracy.

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
sheeeeeeeela from ny, ny

God, this guy makes Sarah Palin sound like a genius. I really do want to contribute to his opponent.

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

#21

Sigh....I guess you are right...

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
Casey

It's ironic that this guy says that gay marriage should be banned because children need families with a mother and a father. His district is chock-full of single-parent, unmarried households.

Jun. 08 2009 10:15 AM
Carlos P. from New York City

Is this guy for real? Just listening to him embarrasses me as a latino. I just have to wonder if he realizes how much of a jackass he comes across with his inane comments. Stick your head in the sand sir, and keep it there.

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
eligit

this dude is a pathetic excuse for a politician and a sad excuse for a man. listen to him stutter and grumble his way through his sad retrograde caveman "position". pitiful. he can barely construct a coherent sentence.

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
Hugh from Brookyn

Thank you, Mr. Lehrer, for challenging Ruben Diaz.

Diaz routinely comes across as sounding like he would like a return to the Holy Inquisition. He sounds staggeringly ignorant and deeply bigoted. It's disturbing that he has been able to wield so much power in the state Senate.

Bravo to all commenters supporting equal rights for all, equal rights to marry, equal right to parents and equal rights to parent.

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
mel from brooklyn

It's incredible this guy is an elected official (although I guess that says something about his constituency). I can't see who could possibly care whether gay people marry. I wish we could just pass the bill and finally address issues that affect many, many more people.

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
David from Manhattan

Ask Sen. Diaz where exactly it says in the bible that gay marriage is forbidden. You might also ask him if he eats pork -- which is forbidden in the Bible.

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
Nina from East Village

People actually elected this dinosaur? He would lose a 5th Grade debate.

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
maya from Jersey City, NJ

Ruben Diaz should be ASHAMED OF HIMSELF for his efforts at blocking marriage equality.. this is not worthy of being a Democrat.. the Democratic Party stands for EQUAL RIGHTS FOR EVERYONE.. and for this guy to evoke his religion and other myths as an excuse for his efforts is, again, NOT WORTHY OF BEING A DEMOCRAT.. why doesn't he just switch to the GOP already?? they need people....;) :)

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
DarkSymbolist from NYC

This guy was elected to office? He's an idiot...I mean he can't put a coherent or logical thought together...

wtf???

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
JC from Brooklyn

Do not seek revenge or bear a grudge against one of your people, but love your neighbor as yourself. - Leviticus 19:18

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
matt from milwaukee

I am a minister ordained over the internet. I have performed 5 weddings in various states. When I register with the states, I hear the same thing over and over from states' registrars offices: it is ILLEGAL for them to even ask what religion I am. I have no religion. Therefore, as far as the state cares, marriage is simply a contract. Period. This is absolutely the non-issue of all non-issues.

Jun. 08 2009 10:14 AM
Mike

I think this guy is a prime example of racism=ignorance.

Jun. 08 2009 10:13 AM
Aaron from brooklyn

Yes please keep allowing this man to make a complete idiot of himself. Amazing. 'The Bible doesn't condone slavery'!!!!

Jun. 08 2009 10:13 AM
Koli Mitra from Washington DC

Who voted for this guy Diaz? He is incoherent -- oh wait, that's not a hindrance to being a politician...

Jun. 08 2009 10:13 AM
Chris from Brooklyn

This is painful. Maybe you should just start humoring the guy.

Jun. 08 2009 10:13 AM
christa from jersey city

get 'im, Brian!

Jun. 08 2009 10:13 AM
Jennifer from NYC

Grill him!

Jun. 08 2009 10:13 AM
Matt from Brooklyn

Senator Diaz: Should straight divorce be illegal? You know, so as not to hurt the children?

Jun. 08 2009 10:13 AM
Brian from Brooklyn

This guy is a Senator?

Jun. 08 2009 10:12 AM
james from caroll gardens

Listening to this guest talk is painful to my ears. On the other hand, if he represents the opposition to gay marriage, I'm heartened!

Jun. 08 2009 10:12 AM
Suki from Williamsburg

This guy is a total idiot. Good lord...

Jun. 08 2009 10:12 AM
Marielle from Brooklyn

Brian, you are beating a man with no arms. He can barely form a coherent thought, let alone defend his despicable position. He is his own worst enemy.

Jun. 08 2009 10:12 AM
Robert

Ha, I love this interview. Ruben Diaz is completely inarticulate in his political views. And how could he be otherwise? His position is totally indefensible.

Jun. 08 2009 10:12 AM
Jennifer from NYC

What does the bible have to do with this? This is law we are talking about. Who you Marry does not affect me - and the idea that people are so insecure in their lives is beyond me. Gay marriage all the way!

Jun. 08 2009 10:12 AM
Bo from Brooklyn - Prospect Heights

He's an idiot (which obviously doesn't preclude his holding office.) But we're not ruled by "the Bible" (which does condone slavery). We're ruled by a Constitution. It doesn't metter if it's part of his "belief"...we have separation of Church and State. He should resign.

Remind him that Abraham had 700 wives.

Jun. 08 2009 10:11 AM
Craig from Manhattan

Wow. Brian is doing a great job here. Awesome.

Jun. 08 2009 10:11 AM
db from nyc

Brian, please chew this idiot up!

Jun. 08 2009 10:11 AM
bernard joseph from brooklyn

this guy is a state senator?? are you kidding me?

Jun. 08 2009 10:10 AM
Casey

Brian, please grill Diaz. Don't let him off easy.

Jun. 08 2009 10:09 AM
Marcia from Inwood

Why doesn't everyone call the office of Ruben Diaz and say they will be contributing to his opponent in the next primary? Perhaps he can be persuaded to abstain from voting.

Jun. 08 2009 10:09 AM
MichaelB from Morningside Heights

Gay Marriage?

What about an issue that almost never reaches the public or media consciousness?

Shared parenting.

Don't know what it's about? I'm not surprised.

It's the idea that in a divorce with children, the starting presumption should be that both parents have equal rights and responsibilities for the care of the children and that children have a right to both parents.

Giving one parent more say in the children's lives gives the the ability to use the children for emotional blackmail and as a weapon to punish their ex-spouse.

The question isn't about whether most custodial parents would use that power -- thankfully we hope most wouldn't -- it is about the thousands that do.

Father's Day is in 2 weeks, and I don't know whether I will see my 2 boys, nor when I will next be able to take my boys to see their 90 year old, bed-ridden grandmother in the nursing home.

We've heard about gay marriage almost daily for years now. How many children are affected by the lack of equality and justics in the custody laws and we almost never hear ANYTHING about it?

Jun. 08 2009 10:05 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

Mike,

In the case of politicians like President Obama and Vice President Biden, my guess is that they are afraid of losing both the popular vote and votes in the Congress and are not afraid of the love between two people. Unfortunately, our President and Vice President are not courageous people or even moral people. In the case of President Obama, I would say, “Please keep your tolerance of religion inspired hate off of people’s bodies.” Nice post sweety.

Jun. 08 2009 09:47 AM
Mike from Clinton Hill, Brooklyn

Why are Christians, Muslims, and Jews so afraid of love between two humans? Please keep your religion inspired hate off my body!

Jun. 08 2009 09:05 AM
Peter from Sunset Park

Hey Sweeties,

Wouldn’t it be great to have some presidential leadership on this issue? What a shame that President Obama is following the path blazed by President Clinton and President Bush. If gays, lesbians and bisexuals are not good enough to serve in the military and take a bullet for their country (as President Obama believes), then why should the general public or elected politicians support gay marriage? What a pity that the first African American president doesn’t have the courage to support the human and civil rights of all Americans.

“Don’t Ask Don’t Tell” is a Democratic initiative that is having disastrous human rights consequences for Americans. I look forward to the day that the Democratic party is able to rise above bigotry, discrimination and the fear of those who they perceive as different.

Jun. 08 2009 08:13 AM

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