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Funny how the SUPREME COURT comes up over and over as a reason to vote for Obama. Once again pro-life Dems are treated as if they didn't exist, like pro choice republicans. Abortion on demand isn't even on my list of concerns. I couldn't care less about court appointments as an election issue. Congress makes laws. If they dont like the way a court rules, they can change the laws. Court nominations as a pressing issue, please!
If Obama wants to win, maybe he should pick a southerner as his running mate.
Maybe a southerner would be a good choice for Obama's vice president. Every Democrat president since 1960 has been either a southerner or had a southener as a vice president.
"What don't you understand about a stolen primary election, caucus fraud, unfair reflection and rampant sexism and misogyny against Clinton and her supporters? What don't you understand about the RBC breaking their own rules and giving Obama four of HRC's earned delegates?"
Obama is not the perfect candiate by any strtech, but he is head and shoulders above an elderly, war-mongering John McCain.Hillary lost fair and square. PUMA supporters need to grow up and face reality. Hillary has left the building.
Anyone who is naive enough to say PUMA is a GOP creation needs to be thrown out of the party. Sorry, but PUMA is lifelong Dems. Not college kids who just registered to vote. Some of us care about democracy. Some of us care about actually winning the White House. Have you seen the polls today? McCain's up by 5 and he hasn't lifted a finger. Obama is down in every swing state, his electoral map is worse than Kerry's, Gores even Dukakis. If he is made the nominee, HE WILL LOSE. I can only hope that PUMA saves this party from itself.
Right on, SusanSoCal!
The Obots are disillusioning themselves by spreading the PUMA's are repubs.
OBOTS: Save your Supreme Court arguments, too. As a lifelong MODERATE democrat- I have never supported uber-liberal Justices... SJ's need to follow the constitution, not make laws from the bench! And Roe v Wade? Stupid argument- we've had mostly conservative presidents since 72- do you see R v W overturned? Don't be so naive!
I will never, not ever, support Nobama for any office of the land. I've done my homework- and unlike the kool-aid drinking media- I vetted him a long time ago.
PUMA POWER!Plan A: Hillary ClintonPlan B: John McCain
Susansocal wrote:Quote from Richard of Montclair: "Puma is a Karl Rove creation -- they pretend to be dems and attempt to divide the party"
Richard, for goodness sake, lay off the Kool Aid. You sound as goofy as your candidate, Obama. You and others who insist the Pumas are Republicans are living in a dream world. What don't you understand about a stolen primary election, caucus fraud, unfair reflection and rampant sexism and misogyny against Clinton and her supporters? What don't you understand about the RBC breaking their own rules and giving Obama four of HRC's earned delegates?
Pumas are life-long Democrats, Richard, and they don't like having an experienced and inarticulate candidate shoved down their throats, a candidate who was selected, not elected.
It's time to stop drinking the Kool Aid and grow up.
Is this Hilary thing for real or did I just hear a couple of New Yorkers remind each other how important New York is to the rest of the country?
Quote from Richard of Montclair: "Puma is a Karl Rove creation -- they pretend to be dems and attempt to divide the party"
Richard, lay off the Kool Aid. You and others who insist the Pumas are Republicans are living in a dream world. What don't you understand about a stolen primary election, caucus fraud, unfair reflection and rampant sexism and misogyny against Clinton and her supporters? What don't you understand about the RBC breaking their own rules and giving Obama four of HRC's earned delegates?
Pumas are life-long Democrats, Richard, and they don't like having an experienced and inarticulate candidate shoved down their throats, a candidate who was selected, not elected.
I have a sincere question for Obama supporters: have you done any research on your candidate or are you voting for him simply because you think he is 'new politics', hip and cool, younger than the other candidates?
Please do some research before you badmouth other candidates supporters and for heaven's sake, put the 'racist' name calling to rest. It's really getting old! Many people simply will not vote for Obama because they have done their research and have found valid reasons to withhold their votes. And guess what, it has NOTHING to do with skin color!
Yeah, Obama bin Laden moniker has already been floating around. I hear it from most mostly religious, right family. Also they tend to believe he might be the anti-Christ. They are bit melodramatic, to say say the least.
I was being sarcastic. My point is that among some Hillary diehards, the only thing Obama could do to satisfy them is to step down the day after his inauguration and let her take over. Obviously, I hope Obama makes the correct decision and picks anybody but Hillary for his running mate. She will do him far more harm than good in spite of what Brian thinks.
"Independent" Word Boy from yesterday missed an obvious toy for this election in one scenario:
"Obama bin Biden."
I can already see the bumperstickers...
Really, I can only conclude that the partisans such those with PUMA, are only sucking on sour grapes. They just sore that their candidate lost, and mainly just want to do anything to bring down Obama so that Hillary can run in 2012. They care nothing for the nation in the meantime, even if McCain would solidly put the Supreme Court in the hands of the right. They are blind fools. I seriously doubt there is any significant ground swell support for Hillary across the nation, it's just a very small and vocal minority.
I wonder how comfortable these Clinton supporters’s smug self-righteousness will be when the Supreme Court is filled with Thomases, Ilitos and Scalias, Roe v Wade is no more and criminal justice in the US consists of pillories and stakes. Why on earth do these people want to (pardon the term) emasculate Clinton by making her Vice President when she could grow in stature and power by assuming Kennedy’s mantel as the focus of power in the Senate. If Obama loses as a result of their sitting out this race do they really think they will be welcomed back into the Democratic fold or can take it over themselves?
With all due respect, Seth from L.I., I certainly understand your frustration with certain irrational Clinton supporters who refuse to stay within the DNP and shift their support to Obama. However, to my knowledge there is no precedent in the Executive Branch anywhere in US history where the preseident elect conceded to his respective V.P. and that is partly owing to the fact that the VP is appointed by the pres. candidate and not voted on nationally. Further there isn't any law anywhere or any article in any constituion or bill in the US that clearly states its even possible unless he dies. What are you implying???
I hope people will put the good of the country above personal feelings about the candidates. Think of not just the Supreme Court but every vacancy on the federal courts. Think of Obama's 86% rating from the League of Conservation Voters, >3 times as high as McCain's 24%. Think of their differences on the war in Iraq & Afghanistan.
If you absolutely cannot bring yourself to vote for either of them, still don't stay home! Vote to give us a higher Democratic majority in the House & Senate--to either support Obama or put a brake on McCain.
And to Robbie [#15], the problem is, if *they* get what's coming to them, so do the rest of us.
Question for Hillary supporters who won't vote for Obama unless Hillary is on the ticket. If Obama picks Hillary and they win, would you like Obama to step down the day after his inauguration so that Hillary can become president?
I agree with Poster #1. Hillary lacks the integrity for running a country as she has ALWAYS put her own personal interests ahead of others. Moreover, do we really want another Clinton anywhere on the ticket??Conversely, if McCain becomes the next Pres. of US, many of US are afraid of, the Market will collapse and we will spiral further in debt as the War marches on, which McCain is openly committed to.I don't know. Obama-Clinton is something I might be able to handle. Even better, he isn't a "knee-jerk" reactionary. Clinton no longer is, even if she had to learn the hard way. At least she's reformed herself.
I saw Hillary speak at the American Federation of Teachers convention in Chicago last month and she distinctly said that we (HRC supporters, especially) should vote for Barack Obama.
She will get a voice in the Obama presidency, whether as a Senator or a cabinet member or a Supreme Court Justice. So for HRC supporters to say that they will not vote for Obama sounds very selfish.
I don't care about the Supreme Court to a certain extent. The power is in the Presidency and Congress - they are just the referees. Having previously said this is not a democracy, I will say to the extent it is a democracy, the people have influence over the Executive and especially Legislative Branch. And this is legitimate unlike 5 people in robes who people call "Justice" deciding things. That is tenuous - you need to gain things the real way. Let the legislatures declare abortion rights etc. and they are much more secure than when judges step in.
85% of the population is dumb deaf and blind when it comes to politics. They don't know why they vote for who they vote for... Americans are to blame for the horrible condition this country is in now. After all even if GWB stole 2 elections, enough idiots voted for him to make it close enough to do so...
i also think as election day nears the non voters could change their minds when they recognize the stakes. But something does need to be done about the democrats - and we should be looking at the polls the way they do at washingtonmonthly.com
Brian, you sound like you're on Hillary's payroll. Can you please try to show some objectivity.
PUMA = NADER 2008
(I believe that the acronym stands for "Party Unity My A__")
I will never vote for Hillary.
I will vote for Obama. I am very proud my $5 dismantled the old guard club HRC & cronies- I welcome new ideas and new faces.
And trolling around Ohio and Indiana to find voters who just can't get over Hillary Clinton is a story, um, why...?
The fact is, nothing would cloud Obama's messsage or sap the energy from his ticket more than putting Clinton on it.
Why? Because Obama's choice of a running mate is far, FAR less about his agreement with his choice on "the issues." Rather, it is about whether the choice shares his vision of governance and leadership.
Obama and Clinton are polar opposites on this most basic point of all.
An Obama-Clinton administration would be an utter nightmare.
Please pay attention. Clinton is from the last political generation. Obama is from the next one.
Stuff White People Like #8: Barack Obama.
"Because white people are afraid that if they don’t like him that they will be called racist."
Comment #25 was addressed to comment #5
Sure, NOW we should we reform the democratic party primaries when a black man wins 11 straight primaries. Also, for the insipid folks..... we nominate the nominee via DELEGATES, not popular vote!! And Hilary did not even get that!....Credit HOWARD DEAN for realizing that to win, we needed a 50 state strategy..
AGAIN, Senator Obama does NOT need HRC to win the election. puhleease stop saying that!
#22 - Katarina,I defend those who choose not to vote, especially for the 2 main parties. This is no democracy! This is a sick polity controlled by 2 factions of the business party. If I want to abstain, boycott, or just be lazy and not vote, that is just as legitimate as the suspension of disbelief required in pullint the levers in the voting booth.
I don't understand how so many people say they just might not vote at all. What does that accomplish? There's never a perfect candidate. I don't agree 100% with Obama or Clinton, but it was always my intention to support the Democratic candidate. Some of the reasons these people give make no sense. Maybe if they did a little research they would have a better understanding of the actual issues. I also don't understand the desire to have Hilary as VP. What do her supporters think she's going to be? Mini-president?
Were Bill Clinton's remarks in South Carolina during the primary racist or just prescient?
See how ridiculous it sounds??!
The Hillary supporters need to realize one thing -- if they do not vote or vote for McCain, they will be to blame for the country staying on its current course (bad economy, terrible housing market, high unemployment, reduction of women's reproductive rights).
ALso if you HRC supporters think she would win in 2012 if Obama won you have another thing coming.
If Hillary is the VP do not count on me.
do all these hillary supporters realize that a "no vote" is like voting for mccain?
if you would normally vote democrat and you don't vote, then your vote = 0, and a vote for mccain = 1. so, by not voting at all, you are essentially voting for mccain.
I do like Biden - even if he's a white mail - I also like Ron Paul - I have been saying all along that the Democrats would fidn a way to shoot itself in teh foot and once again hand teh election to the republicans when republicans are disguested with republicans. I am a democrat, the loser party. Only 1 dem president in 40 years, and that was Bill Clinton. I will probably vote of Obama because I don't want McCain but I agree with those who want the DNC to be chastened and reformed.
I have just TWO WORDS for any Democrat who is either considering not voting or, even worse, voting for McCain, SUPREME COURT. Anyone who considers themselves to be on the left, a democrat, etc. will only be hurting themselves and the country by not voting for Obama. PLEASE just think about the Supreme Court and vote for Obama. I have plenty of reservations about him as well, but once those nominations are made, and they will be during the next presidency, we are stuck and if a Republican is making them, we will all be in extremely dangerous territory.
Like other candidates, she pledged not to campaign in Florida. Then when it looked grim she changed her mind. Come on people.
to: In Napa, Some Wineries Choose the Old Route1. The Democratic Convention is first, ergo today's discussion. When the Republican Convention happens, we will discuss the republicans.2. Ms. Bernstein is DRIVING across the USA, short of driving miles (and days) out of her way, she has to travel through the Midwest.3. If you listen, many of the people she has spoken with are Hillary supporters, so it is not necessarily Barack Obama's "back pocket."
It wont matter. The democratic party is spineless and gutless. They consist of a huge wide variety of people who don't have any other umbrella to come together under. As Andrew Bacevich unless you have a wholesale change in the Congress and hold these people accountable to do your( the peoples bidding) instead of this farce that somehow a president can bring about change.Ill take a dollah bet that John McCain will win this election, a country whose polls constantly show 80 plus percent of the people think the country is going in the wrong direction etc The two candidates are running almost neck and neck instead of a landslide margin for Obama ...
Puma is a Karl Rove creation -- they pretend to be dems and attempt to divide the party
I am a 29 year old professional woman. I would just like to voice my oppinion that it is ridiculous that anyone would say they will not vote! This is a democratic system, you may not always agree with the candidates presented but it is your duty as a citizen to weigh your options and make a decision! Do not shirk your responsibility!
I'm sorry, but these Clinton supporters who refuse to vote from Obama have not had very strong reasons for their decisions. The two are almost exactly the same on the issues--one has to wonder what the real reason they refuse to vote for Obama is.
What is PUMA? What do they stand for? Are they D or R?
Regardless of whom people liked, Clinton or Obama, I think staying home and not voting is the worst thing to do on Election Day.
Astonishing... I really can't believe that people who claim to be Democrats are willing to throw this presidential election to the Republicans by not voting for Obama. I can't see any rational reason... it just seems like sour grapes.
PUMA and other so-called Democrats are merely thinly-veiled racists. They should vote McCain and get what's coming to them.
Puhleze. PUMA my ***If you don't vote, or if you vote for McCain you are just shooting yourself in the foot.Another Republican in office means a right-wing Supreme Court.Get Real! View the reality!
My new slogan is Obama if hillary's not the VP dont count on me.
Haha - the PUMA movement. Repugnican "grass roots" at work.
I am a Republican who plans on voting for Obama. I know several other Republicans who plan to do likewise.
I will not vote for Obama with Hillary on the ticket. Many current Obama supporters, Democrat and Republican, have indicated to me they would do likewise.
Many people feel a innate aversion to the politics of the Clintons. Let's move America to a better place and leave the Bush-Clinton legacy behind.
If he does not choose Hillary Clinton for VP dont count on me I wont vote for anyone she is the best choice.
why are we still talking about HRC.
[[Moderator Writes: A gentle reminder to keep your comments civil and productive to the discussion taking place on the air. Thank you.-BL Show-]]
I personally like Biden. But if it is going to be Kaine or Bayh, it might as well be Clinton.
Please no more life long democrats that voted for Hill_dog that will now vote McCain... (i.e. racists)
WNYDNC returns with a new Democratic broadcast for Wednesday August 20th, 2008.
Today's show will continue the 365 part series regarding Barack Hussein Obama and why he is well...just SO perfect for everyone in the world in every way possible.
Andrea Bernstein reports today on the road from BHO's back pocket...
Bayh is/was wrong on all the major issues, and in this regard is less like the general public and more like McCain/Bush. So much for "the middle!"
biden is still in it, notwithstanding his statements to the contrary; bayh highly unlikely, in part because of his wife's many corporate ties.
Bayh. Biden is too risky, and Obama doesn't take risks.
Anybody but Hillary. Hillary lacks the integrity and character to be VP or President. She'll always put her own interests above the interests of the nation.
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