Streams

Obama's Energy Policy

Tuesday, August 05, 2008

Senator Barack Obama's new energy plan supports limited offshore oil drilling. Dr. Joseph Romm, Senior Fellow at the Center for American Progress, and Ken Green, Resident Scholar at American Enterprise Institute, discuss the impact of his compromise on the presidential race.

Guests:

Ken Green and Dr. Joseph Romm

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Comments [101]

Peter from Park Slope

Ed,

I don't share your hope that Obama will save the world from racism. It took Obama 20 years to denounce the racism in his own church. I expect more from a presidential candidate.

Aug. 06 2008 01:19 AM
Ed from Newark

Longtime listener, firsttime joining the comment board. I just want to say this to everyone choosing sen Obama as the next president of usa will save not only usa but the whole world from hatred, racism, poverty, hope of self esteem, and most importantly proxy decision of fighting war. This brother is a chosing spirit from the heavenly father. That of course is a personal opinion but it is a vision. And it's only usa will have someone like that. We must choose well for the hope of change. God bless us all

Aug. 05 2008 10:17 PM
Peter from Park Slope

KC:

As far as "brash generalizations" go, that may make you feel good, but you should learn to support your comments with specifics of some sort. Otherwise, it is just blowing hot air. Also, I have voted for ONE republican pres, not two, so perhaps you should pay closer attention before needling someone with misinformation. Just review my post and you will see the error in your ways.

On planet Earth, when one is a registered independent and votes for candidates from two parties on the same election day, it usually means that he or she is not a registered republican. Try and look past party affiliations and generalizations, you may find it opens your mind to new ideas and thoughts you now see as dangerous.

Aug. 05 2008 09:10 PM
KC from NYC

Peter: I don't care what party you identify with when you make your brash generalizations. Quoting myself: "With this kind of thinking, it's not too surprising your party has run us into a ditch."

The "us" part is kind of crucial. It implies, in this case, the United States. (I guess that was too ambiguous?) Excuse me for thinking that voting for two Republican presidential candidates in a row might in some way identify you with the Republican Party. It's just that here, on planet earth where I live, that kind of conclusion makes some sense.

Aug. 05 2008 07:17 PM
Peter from Park Slope

JONP: Thanks for the support, I appreciate being disagreed with in a civil manner. There needs to be more civility on all such boards, from all sides.

KC: You are fixated on Obama getting big crowds. This is true, but as I said in my first post, my main concern is that he flips on many major issues. I have also stated clearly that he has very little experience, especially compared to McCain. You seem to think I am some right wing zealot. I live in NYC, I teach, about 99 percent of everyone I know is pretty far left. Obama sat in a racist church for 20 years, flips on major issues, and has very little experience. You also said that my party is in a ditch, but I am a registered independent, so your point is just kind of odd.

MC: I voted straight democratic line all my life, including Gore in 200, but voted Bush in 04. I also voted Clinton for senator. I just don’t make any choices based on party – I have been voting for going on two decades and about 90-95% of my votes go to the dems, (more if you count Bloomberg as a Dem), but I will vote Republican like I did for Bush in 04 when I feel the choice is better. I was hoping to have the option to vote Clinton, but with Hillary out of the race, only McCain for me is left. I do see McCain as a departure, in a good way, for the right. I like his views on Iraq and am saddened to hear his recent comments on gay marriage. There is no excuse for that, but I still don’t feel that Obama has the experience.

Aug. 05 2008 06:44 PM
KC from NYC

Hi mc:

Yeah, I don't have answers either. I think it would require such a massive overhaul at this point – and said overhaul would step on so many special interest groups' toes – that's it's close to unimaginable. Meanwhile, federal laws in states where said laws are really, really despised are now functionally circumvented. For example, abortion is essentially illegal in a lot of southern states. I'm not personally into that, but hey: it's really the will of the majority in those states, and I'm more than willing to grant them their local democracy if they don't force their ideas on me. Yet our state suffers through the "Drug War" and the prison-industrial complex and No Child Left Behind – federal reflections of a morality that makes no sense as government policy. Everyone knows those are failed policies; why must we put up with them? I can't believe I'm writing this, but I would much rather have local politicians and community leaders deciding standards on education and healthcare. The federal government is just a drain on those things (remember when Bush sued California for trying to reduce air pollution? So much worse than useless). If people in Alabama don't want to elect people who care abut those things, that's fine by me. Their choice.

Aug. 05 2008 05:24 PM
mc from Brooklyn

Hi KC,
This is really interesting. Do you think the federal government should regulate anything at all? Should there be a national standard for say, a high shcool education? I know what you mean by the federal government's lack of grace, and I agree about neither party being interested in states' rights. But what about services that we feel everyone should have access to such as education, health care, public safety? Or should we all have access? Or should we get it a different way? And what standard should we use? I don't have answers - clearly we're not doing it very well now - I'm interested in hearing alternatives from anywhere.

Aug. 05 2008 04:46 PM
KC from NYC

mc: I wish Bob Barr were more appealing. I just generally feel like our federal government is too big, it doesn't address local issues with any grace at all, and neither major party is interested in states' rights. (Sorry, Republicans; Reagan was a disaster for states' rights, repeatedly taking states to court over issues of "interstate commerce", ie: dictating state law through highway funding extortion. Our idiotic quasi-national alcohol and drug laws? Reagan's and Nixon's faults, respectively. There would be no ATF for Republicans to complain about were it not for the Republican party itself.)

The Democrats are equally invested in the continuation of our dysfunctional federal bureaucracy, they just offer a different brand. This year, their brand is "competence". While they may be only marginally more competent than the GOP, this does have its appeal at the moment.

Aug. 05 2008 03:12 PM
mc from Brooklyn

David!
I spent the last month in eastern Ohio on a school campus on a working farm. It was very interesting.

KC,
Would you be unaffiliated if you could be and still vote in the primaries? I wish I could continue this conversation, but I have run out of time. I'll try to tune in later, maybe around 5:30 and see what else comes up. What do you find attractive about the Libertarians? Do you like Bob Barr? Ron Paul?

Aug. 05 2008 02:18 PM
KC from NYC

mc: I'm close to voting for the Libertarians, and I'm genuinely undecided. When I see McCain making comments that seem to indicate he neither knows nor cares about, say, the difference between Sunnis and Shiites (dismissed as a minor gaff by the mainstream media, yet he's made the "mistake" numerous times), that's the kind of scary stuff that makes me want to go for Obama. I did vote for him in the primaries (as you know, you have to be registered in a party to vote in New York primaries, whereas I was unaffiliated in my previous state), and I knew he was a good politician, rather than something above that...still the FISA vote was awful.

It was an interesting form of hardball too, though; with it, the Senate assured that the next president will have unprecedented powers, and Obama's question to voters became, well, "Whom would you rather have wielding this unprecedented executive power? Me, or McCain?" The guy is good at this game, in his way. Kind of the same way Ataturk was good at it...

Aug. 05 2008 02:10 PM
David! from NYC

mc,
Thanks. Yep, she's my first and it has been quite a ride so far. As I think about her growing older, part of me is really thrilled while another part is scared.

So, what have you been up to?

Aug. 05 2008 02:03 PM
mc from Brooklyn

David!

Congrats on your daughter's first birthday. Is she your first? You are in for the ride of your life. It gets harder but it also gets way cooler!

Glad you haven't given up on us NYCers on these boards.

Aug. 05 2008 01:53 PM
mc from Brooklyn

Peter, I can see that you support McCain, you have stated that explicitly. Were you also a Bush supporter? Or do you see McCain as a departure from the recent Republican politics? Not trying to start an argument, just curious.

KC, I can see that you are not really an Obama supporter. Do you have a candidate that you prefer? You don't sound like a McCain supporter - is it Nader for you this year? Or do you plan to vote for Obama as the lesser of two evils? Again, not trying to start an argument, just curious. Were you ever an Obama supporter or did you have a different favorite in the Dem primaries? Or are you unaffiliated with the Dems?

Aug. 05 2008 01:50 PM
David! from NYC

mc--I've been busy but good. Lots of things happening at the office, as well as coordinating plans for family coming into town to celebrate my daughter's first birthday at the end of the month. (Wow! Where does time go?)

***

re: I agree that this forum should invite an exchange of ideas, but some attack personally instead of debating positions. IMO, that's wrong.

Aug. 05 2008 01:46 PM
the truth from Atlanta/New York

They went "off topic" hours ago.

Aug. 05 2008 01:36 PM
KC from NYC

I get it Peter: I'm touchy. Write that again – it makes you sound so above it all.

Of all the substantive points one could make about Obama, yours is "Hey, he gets really big crowds!"

What's funny about your nonsense, GOP-party-line "critique" is that my comments here have been critical of Obama (whom I don't really support), but you're so used to arguing with people who defend him that you didn't bother to check what I'd said. With this kind of thinking, it's not too surprising your party has run us into a ditch.

Aug. 05 2008 01:36 PM
the truth from Atlanta/New York

Good point Jon P. #83 - I stopped posting and just started reading b/c my posts keep getting deleted when I defend my views/opinions. I guess it's true, some people cant handle the truth.

The above between Peter and KC is very heated, yet NOT deleted. Interesting.

Aug. 05 2008 01:35 PM
mc from Brooklyn

Jon P.

Thank you. You speak my mind.

Aug. 05 2008 01:32 PM
Jon P. from Hewitt, NJ

Peter and KC,

I don’t agree with either of your views. But I agree to disagree. What is the point of an opinion page if everyone has the same opinion? Isn’t that just preaching to the choir? How do we learn if we just want to listen to those only like ourselfs? So keep on posting even if those that disagree with you cry out that your just whining.

Aug. 05 2008 01:24 PM
mc from Brooklyn

David!
I have been - though gone for awhile. And you?

AWM, c'mon. We have had debates on these boards, you and I. This is unworthy of you, who has often posted very thoughtful ideas.

Aug. 05 2008 01:20 PM
David! from NYC

mc, thank you. Hope you've been well.

Aug. 05 2008 01:17 PM
Peter from Park Slope

AWM:

The only person calling names and whining is you.

Aug. 05 2008 01:03 PM
Peter from Park Slope

KC:

Stating facts such as Obama being treated like a rock star is not nonsense, it is what it is. I am still not sure why you are so touchy about it. The DNC has a challenge on their hands. They want to treat Obama like a rock star, but get mad when such treatment reminds folks that his elected experience is much closer to that of a rock star's than to McCain's years of service.

I am for McCain, but I don't always agree wit him. McCain's tactical decision to not talk straight about gay adoption makes him look really bad, and I can admit that. It doesn't make sense to me why Obama supporters view any and all critical looks at Obama as a threat. Perhaps it is because I live in a part of the country where voting anything other than the democraticic line is a serious offense.

Aug. 05 2008 01:02 PM
AWM from UWS

"Stick to the issues?"

:-)

"McCain is nothing like Hitler"

"I wish McCain could fill a stadium"

Sorry,

Yawn!

Enough of this!

Let the whine fest CONTINUE.

The floor is yours.

Aug. 05 2008 12:53 PM
KC from NYC

Peter: I'm not touchy; your point is hypocritical nonsense. It has nothing to do with anything.

Aug. 05 2008 12:44 PM
Peter from Park Slope

KC:

I wish H. Clinton or McCain together could sell out a stadium, or a movie theater for that matter. I am not sure why you are touchy about that.

AWM:

Funny how you resort to name calling and then predict that others will "whine." So, when folks disagree with you, they are whiners, trolls, extremists...have I left anything out?
Perhaps you could just stick to the issues. Less name calling, more insights. You make the left look bad with your name calling.

Aug. 05 2008 12:38 PM
mc from Brooklyn

David!

Welcome back. We missed you (or some of us did).

Aug. 05 2008 12:26 PM
KC from NYC

"Obama is popular, can sell out stadiums like a New Kids on The Block show"

...Or like an Arnold Schwarzenegger (or Ronald Reagan) blockbuster movie sells out the multiplex?

Aug. 05 2008 12:14 PM
David! from NYC

Peter, agree.

Aug. 05 2008 12:08 PM
AWM from UWS

Yawn!

Enough of this!
Let the whine fest begin.
The floor is yours.

Aug. 05 2008 12:05 PM
Peter from Park Slope

yup, the name calling begins. Gotta love it!

Aug. 05 2008 12:03 PM
Peter from Park Slope

David,

Well, the DNC is wise to play to Obama's strengths. They treat him like a rock star, but then get upset when others comment that he is treated like a rock star. I wish McCain could fill a stadium, I doubt it though. That makes me sad. Obama is popular, can sell out stadiums like a New Kids on The Block show, and does flip flops the whole time.

Aug. 05 2008 12:02 PM
AWM from UWS

Peter is a dope

Aug. 05 2008 12:00 PM
Peter from Park Slope

67

?

Aug. 05 2008 11:58 AM
AWM from UWS

#65,

?

Aug. 05 2008 11:56 AM
David! from NYC

Peter,

Thanks for the link. I'll have to check it out. Speaking of comparisons to Hitler, or at least his use of "the crowd" in his rise to power, I find it interesting that the DNC is opting to move Obama's acceptance speech from the convention center to a stadium.

Will there also be orthodoxy tests?

Aug. 05 2008 11:56 AM
Peter from Park Slope

AWM:

You are really into shifting the focus onto yourself, aren't you?

Aug. 05 2008 11:51 AM
KC from NYC

AWM: Thanks. Agreed, especially the sad part. "Headache-inducing" is what I was thinking.

Aug. 05 2008 11:49 AM
Peter from Park Slope

David,

Thanks, that is exactly how I feel.

Recently, I was listening to "To the Point", hosted by Warren Olney, of Boston Public radio. One of Olney's guest compared McCain to Hitler about 7-8 times (the link is below). Yet no one on the show, not Olney, not the other guests, stopped and commented that in fact, McCain is nothing like Hitler. Could you ever imagine a public radio host allowing a guest to compare Obama to Hitler? I love public radio, but they sure seem in the tank for Obama.

http://www.kcrw.com/news/programs/tp/tp080711barack_obama_jesse_j

Aug. 05 2008 11:49 AM
AWM from UWS

David!

You are really into shifting the focus onto yourself, aren't you?

Aug. 05 2008 11:45 AM
AWM from UWS

#58,

Thanks, KC. Good stuff.
Sad, but good.

Aug. 05 2008 11:43 AM
Steve from NY, NY

The guest host's giggling response to the tire inflation fact suggests both her lack of homework, and the success of Republican lying.

According to the Energy Information Administration (i.e. a federal governement agency, part of DoE & EPA under George Bush), tire efficiency could save approximately 800,000 barrels of oil a day immediately, compared to the 200,000 barrels a day that would come in the year 2030 if the U.S. were to open up the "lower-48" outer continental shelf to off-shore drilling.

To put that in personal terms: Keeping your tires properly inflated, saves up to 12 cents a gallon, compared to the 6 cents per gallon that coastal and Arctic National Wildlife Refuge drilling combined would gets you in 20 years.

Aug. 05 2008 11:41 AM
David! from NYC

Peter,
I feel your pain. I post rarely because, when I do, others attack. Often, they express shock and indignation at the right, yet they engage in identical action. Some even carry high the Obama flag, but when questioned, promptly announce themselves independents.
Shalom...

Aug. 05 2008 11:33 AM
KC from NYC

AWM: Actually, Obama voted against the amendment you mentioned, but then voted for the overall FISA "reform" bill, including the amendment that he had pledged to filibuster.

See also: http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/06/21/obama/

Aug. 05 2008 11:30 AM
Flippity Floppity from nyc

Adding to the confusion in the study of Obamaflopping is presence of numerous, competing metaphors.

Popular metaphors include "the bus", as in "Who got thrown under the bus today?", and competitive diving, as in "Wow, Obama did a double back flip!!"

Some have taken to calling him "Backtrack Barack"!

Aug. 05 2008 11:24 AM
AWM from UWS

#52

The vote wasn't on whether or not a government agency does or doesn't need a warrant. That, unfortunately, has already been established. It was an amendment to the FISA bill on whether the telecoms would have immunity from lawsuits among other things.

Stop living in a world of generalizations.

Aug. 05 2008 11:20 AM
KC from NYC

The FISA vote was a shame, and not particularly smart politics. Much like Clinton's vote authorizing war, it was a compromise that cut off the base with a glib sort of presumption that the base would stick with him anyway. And like Clinton's vote, I wonder whether it will prove politically costly.

Aug. 05 2008 11:18 AM
Peter from Park Slope

A few weeks ago I posted that Obama was doing the ole flip flop on many issues and I was promptly called a "troll." Now half of the posts here are saying the same thing. What I have learned is that all of us who look closely at Obama must be trolls and we all must be wrong. Obama is perfect, forget the dozen or so issues he has flip flopped on. I am a troll and a racist and a bad person for questioning Obama's direction and experience. I have learned so much on this board! This is all so much easier when I accept name calling and turn off my brain.

Aug. 05 2008 11:12 AM
Flippity Floppity from nyc

The nomenclature of Obamaflopping is worthy of further study too.

Terms like "inartful speech" are used tactically to obscure the true ex-ante and ex-post positions. Thankfully, there are online records of the (hundreds of) positions.

- NAFTA bad, then not so bad
- will speak with any tyrant anytime, then nah
- Jerusalem undivided, then maybe divided

Aug. 05 2008 11:12 AM
jaime

oh, and yes, i guess i am just sitting around complaining about the bill of rights be torn apart amendment by amendment... how petty of me. :::rolls eyes:::

Aug. 05 2008 11:10 AM
jaime

One doesn't need to be a constitutional lawyer to know the damage that the FISA bill Mr. Obama voted for does to the fourth amendment... you just need to read what the bill accomplished: it means that a government agency doesn't need a warrant to tap your phones... severely weakening the fourth amendment.

Keep apologizing for him while he supports Bush administration tactics and policies, while decrying the very administration. Sounds like the definition of hypocrisy to me

Aug. 05 2008 11:09 AM
KC from NYC

Sorry; he is "knowingly saying false things."

Some would call it "lying", and some of us are frustrated by the way that word is no longer allowed in political conversation.

Aug. 05 2008 11:04 AM
AWM from UWS

#42,

"Assassinate the 4th amendment?"

Pretty strong, are you a constitutional lawyer?

Could one of you people who thinks they are nobler than Obama and/or wiser than his supporters please provide an alternative or some actual ideas that are realistically applicable?

PLEASE!

Anyone can sit around waiting for something else to complain about, which is useless by the way.

Aug. 05 2008 11:03 AM
Jon P. from Hewitt, NJ

#41,

We didn’t go to Iraq for oil, we went for the private contractors supporting the war. Think about it, if we went for oil, the oil wells would have been pumping oil at full capacity a long time ago. Again, oil is a world market. US is not going to profit off of that. Private contractors puts tons of cash in the pockets of rich folk in this country for as long as this war goes on….

Aug. 05 2008 11:01 AM
Brian Lehrer Moderator

Hey Guys,

Just a reminder to please keep your comments civil (no name calling) and on topic.

Thanks,

Brian Lehrer Moderator

Aug. 05 2008 10:59 AM
jim from brooklyn

Has it occured to anyone that since our president spawn from an oil dynasty? There is no shortage. This is colusion w OPEC to force drilling and you can bet prices would go down if it a drilling policy was passed because the prices have been fixed by special interest- namely Bush Inc. who will enjoy the spoils of windfall profits. How many times will the American people be fooled by these clowns?

Aug. 05 2008 10:54 AM
Flippity Floppity from nyc

I have noted vibrant discussions online under headings like "Did Obama flip in time?!"

It appears that calculating the essential ex-post position is difficult, so Obama relies on the speed of flopping itself to gain advantage.

- flag pin bad, then good
- visit hurt soldiers, ...nah German gym better
- single payer health care, then not

Aug. 05 2008 10:53 AM
chris from nyc

I am in the category of people who are definitely being hurt by the current economic situation but I STILL oppose more drilling. I am also aopposed to leaving it to the free market. One of the worst "contributions" of the conservative movement has been persuading people that government is bad. Actually, a government suppoerted by the people can do a good job of many things.

Leaving the energy crisis to the free market just insures that a few people will get very rich at the expense of the rest of us.

Also, one word about a WINFALL PROFITS TAX -- if the energy insudtry were struggling (as it has in the past) it would be the first one breaking down the doors of congress for subsidies and tax breaks (as they have in the past, and which for some inexplicable reason they still have). If Joe public is expected to siupport them when they are weak, should we not get some benfit after they have stood on our backs to get strong?

Aug. 05 2008 10:51 AM
Owen from Rochester

Robert (#36) - I've heard some experts say that electric cars are still better than gasoline-powered cars, despite shifting some of the pollution to the grid, because they cut down on carbon emissions overall. But you're right that they're not a solution by themselves.

Aug. 05 2008 10:51 AM
Michael from NYC

Hey, why don't we nationalize the oil that we drill on offshore platforms? So that oil won't go to the world market and let that oil only be sold on the American market. It would be cheaper oil for the American public, The oil corporations would not make as much money as they would NOT be allowed to sell it on the international market.

Socialism would save the day....
But that would never fly in this country as "If it's not free market, it's not capitalistic, then it's not freedom, freedom is democracy..."

I hate spinnster!!!

Aug. 05 2008 10:50 AM
Marianne from Staten Island, NY

PART OF LEARNING IS CHANGING/SHIFTING OPINIONS.
If you don't change opinion when the facts are there, you never going to LEARN and will become a disinterested, rigid president,"staying on the course"just like the current one who refuse to learn .

Aug. 05 2008 10:49 AM
Robert from NYC

To that caller that we accept the gas prices I say, we're complaisant americans who have come to accept everything our government hands us.

Aug. 05 2008 10:48 AM
Janna Mandate from UES

Ask these people if they think the Iraq war was for oil. Please.

Aug. 05 2008 10:48 AM
BORED

Didn't oil prices go down last week due to a drop in use?

Aug. 05 2008 10:48 AM
hjs from 11211

guest said we can save 5 times by conserving. could that be true??

Aug. 05 2008 10:47 AM
Steve (the other one) from Manhattan

Please ask your guests - don't oil companies have some of their wells capped to keep the price high?

Aug. 05 2008 10:46 AM
robert from park slope

Electric cars merely shift the combustion of fossil fuels from the automobile to the electricity generating plant (assuming the plant burns coal or natural gas). Also, no one has discussed the disposal of the batteries used in these cars. Ten years after we begin using large numbers of electric/hybrid cars, won't we will have a problem with disposing of toxic waste found in the batteries?

Aug. 05 2008 10:46 AM
Flippity Floppity from nyc

Thankfully, the press notes Obama positions ex-ante AND ex-post, as the speed of the flopping itself is difficult to observe by the unaided, naked eye.

Other observations include:
- church state separation good, then bad (fed aid to faith-based services)
- abortion good, then bad (sometimes)
- delegates seatless, then get seats

Aug. 05 2008 10:45 AM
KC from NYC

I wonder what Ken Green's investment portfolio looks like. Think there's a little Exxon/Mobile in there? This is a fantasy debate; it has nothing to do with the facts on the ground. Oil companies just want a gimme from the government, and they're spreading disinformation for that purpose.

Aug. 05 2008 10:44 AM
Jon P. from Hewitt, NJ

Please ask your guests when they actually start drilling fro more oil, where’s the button on the gas pump at Exxon’s gas station that says “US gas only”? Doesn’t exist? Of course not….. US oil is not US oil, its OPEC’s oil and they can sell it where ever they want….. Including not in the USA....

Aug. 05 2008 10:43 AM
World's Toughest Milkman from the_C_train

There is no such thing as clean coal, period, so plugging in your electric car is only moving the pollution from the consumer to the electric producer.

Nuclear is cheap and carbon free and we could plug our electric cars with out polluting.

Bush has a chance to appear to redeem himself somewhat if he would force congress to come back from their month long vacation and get on this problem. Pelosi is an utter fool.

Aug. 05 2008 10:41 AM
the truth from Atlanta/New York

Excellent point Janna.

Aug. 05 2008 10:40 AM
AFB from Riverside Drive

The American Enterprise Institute guy raises a good point we live in an 'energy' civilization. But, he fails to understand that we don't have to continue to use oil and coal as the main form. We can be an energy civilization that uses renewable forms. We can also be an energy civilization that uses less.

The only reason renewable is 'expensive' as he says is because there is so little capital invested in the sector, and there are no subsidies from the Federal govt, or state govts as is the case with oil refineries, and drilling, and coal.

I am definitely against drilling on the continental shelves. We're already drilling in the Gulf, which is where the real oil is.

We need to get more wind and solar going in this country in the next few years, and invest more in improving fuel cell technologies to make them more useful.

Aug. 05 2008 10:40 AM
licnyc from long island city

@Flippity Floppity. Trolling huh?- Flip flopping seems to be the name of the game this election, McCain has flip flopped way more than any other candidate. I don't think anyone should flip flop but of the two running now, McCain is by far the biggest offender of position reversals. There are literally hundreds.

Aug. 05 2008 10:38 AM
Leshka from UES

I read in Time Magazine that even if we start the road to off-shore drilling right now, it would take at least 6 years, if not a decade, for something real to start.

So the idea to drill seems to be a "solution" that will only benefit/destroy us much later on.

Maybe I'm not understanding what McCain means by drilling off-shore, if he means something else.

Aug. 05 2008 10:38 AM
AWM from UWS

Anyone who still uses the term "flip flop" is proof that the media is adept at creating repetitive drones with limited vocabulary, limited ways of expressing themselves… perfect consumers.

How could you not be embarrassed when you use that term?

Aug. 05 2008 10:36 AM
hjs from 11211

if one thinks we should subsidize nuclear why not subsidize renewals instead

licnyc very true, free market and the price won't go down either.

Aug. 05 2008 10:36 AM
Janna Mandate from UES

Uh.... why should we listen to any Republican when it comes to energy policy? They had nearly a decade to bring push their plan/agenda.

Aug. 05 2008 10:36 AM
Tom from Upper West Side

As any recovered oil goes right on the world market, who can prove that any "new" oil produced off-shore or in Alaska will directly impact the US market and its domestic consumers?

Aug. 05 2008 10:35 AM
Sally Forth from Soho

This man is a LIAR. Off-shore drilling has been open for YEARS.

Is he suggesting the government be in control of US oil?

This is a red-herring. It's bogus.

Aug. 05 2008 10:34 AM
Flippity Floppity from nyc

To gather data on Obamaflopping, I used an Internet search engine and the expression "Obama flop". This query yielded over 3 million "hits"! Certainly evidence of megaflopping.

Results included listing for:
- NASA funding to be cut, then not
- FISA bad, then not
- public funding good, then not

Aug. 05 2008 10:34 AM
KC from NYC

Offshore drilling is such a crock. The most optimistic estimates say it might affect oil prices in a decade. Even Bush, when pushed, admitted it would only be useful in encouraging futures traders to project lower prices somewhere down the road. That's a solution? These oil industry shills out to be put on trial, not on talk shows. Liars.

Aug. 05 2008 10:34 AM
licnyc from long island city

Can you please ask- if they drill in america, isn't it possible the oil won't stay in america. Just because they drill here doesn't mean it would end up in american tanks

Aug. 05 2008 10:32 AM
Peter from Brooklyn

There is no flip-flop, read Obama's quote:
"My interest is in making sure that we've got the kind of comprehensive energy policy that can bring down gas prices. ... If, in order to get that passed, we have to compromise in terms of a careful, well thought-out drilling strategy that was carefully circumscribed to avoid significant environmental damage---I don't want to be so rigid that we can't get something done."

Aug. 05 2008 10:32 AM
hjs from 11211

the oil multinatioanals should drill what they have first

Aug. 05 2008 10:32 AM
the truth from Atlanta/New York

Yes please do run the montage on mccain.

Aug. 05 2008 10:31 AM
the truth from Atlanta/New York

I think it is the wise person that knows when to alter the course when needed and not stay the course on a bad idea, i.e.getting us into a war we should not be in, just to save face, prove a point.

Aug. 05 2008 10:30 AM
hjs from 11211

mccain wants to bring the dark ages to this fine nation.

a vote for him is a vote of the agents of intolerance.

Aug. 05 2008 10:29 AM
Owen from Rochester

I am *so mad* at John McCain. I used to respect him more than many other politicians (while never planning to vote for him), but he's crossed some big lines lately. Above all, he has mounted a successful campaign to dupe the American people into demanding this awful policy. He just lies, lies, lies (i.e., drilling = cheaper gas soon), and mostly gets a free pass on it.

I'm disappointed in Obama for giving in, but I get his reasons for it, and I'll forgive him. I won't ever forgive John McCain for the harm his energy policy is already doing to the country and the world.

Aug. 05 2008 10:25 AM
Flippity Floppity from nyc

Given Obama's, what, fewer than 150 days in elected office (before announcing his presidential campaign), his rate of flop is downright astonishing.

His flopping (by computing standards) was, probably megaflopping {10^6} at the start and has has accelerated! Probably yottaflopping now! {10^24}

Aug. 05 2008 10:18 AM
J.C. from Minneapolis

http://www.startribune.com/opinion/commentary/26189764.html?location_refer=Commentary

Aug. 05 2008 10:17 AM
Charles from Brooklyn

Flip-flop this. People need to stop using childish name calling or juvenile concepts. Have some respect for yourselves.

This is a serious and critical situation. Mr. Obama is a reasonable leader who is willing to compromise to move this country forward. That is exactly the type of leadership we desperately needed. And if it means giving the oil industry more windfall profits, temporarily, to make real progess, then let Florida swim in the future oil spills to come.

Aug. 05 2008 10:15 AM
J.C. from Minneapolis

Let's do a show on McCain's flip-flops from offshore drilling (yep, he opposed it) to torture to whether he liked the Bush tax cuts....oh wait, it would be so much longer than what Obama has done it just wouldn't be fair.

Aug. 05 2008 10:12 AM
Steve from NYC

Let's not forget that the historical success of our democracy has been achieved through compromise. As in his statements about offshore drilling, Obama indicates he is open to such compromise. This, to me is a positive attitude. But in today's polarized political atmosphere the media perpetuates this false idea of Obama flip-flopping all the time.

Attempts for political cooperation are so foreign to the media today (and don't make as good a news story) that they do not even know how to report on it anymore.

Aug. 05 2008 10:12 AM
exlege from brooklyn

This entire drilling push is a real red herring and I am confident that this will end up being another generous giveaway to the petroleum industry. I have seen estimates that if the offshore sites in question are as fruitful as the oil industry states that we could see a price decrease of only 4 cents per gallon of gasoline. The price fluctuates mnore than that over a weekend. Not a significant amount to be such a campeign issue.
More importantly, Obama's recent position on energy appear very troubling. Advocating releasing fuel from the strategic reserves is a short-sighted measure which will cost the taxpayer more money to replace in the future. As a nation we need to feel the pain of high fuel prices in order for reduction to occur and alternatives to be brought forward. This is long overdue. Reducing the addition to foreign fuel will not occur with continued false remedies like offshoe drilling, releasing reserves and gas tax holidays. We need fuel to be expensive. As Americans we are wasteful and irresponsible with our fuels. Hoppefully high prices will set us streight and stopgap band-aids will not interfere with forces that will correct our behavior.

Aug. 05 2008 10:10 AM
Flippity Floppity from nyc

Can you at WNYC do a program devoted to the Obama flip flops? Please. I am getting whiplash!

Don't tap SPR; now tap.
Don't drill; now drill.
(Wright buddy, then not; guns bad, then not; surge worthless, then not...)

This is going to be a great election commercial -- windsurfing has been used already -- waffle flipping maybe?

Aug. 05 2008 10:05 AM
michael winslow from INWOOD

Obama flip flops on everything FISA, Oil Drilling, Public Funds for Campaign Can't wait to hear what he flips flop on next.

Now flip flopping is called "Refinning One's position".

Why do the Democrats compromise on EVERYTHING when the Republicans NEVER compromise?

Flip Flopping has a new name "Refinning" LOVE it

Aug. 05 2008 10:02 AM
Anna from Princeton, NJ

this is becoming a bit tiresome, all these switches and changes of opinion on Obama's part, confirming the fears of many who were reluctant to support this largely unknown guy. And guess what - he may just turn out to be a POLITICIAN, after all. Charismatic, sexy, unusual... but right there with the rest of them.I wonder how soon will the 2004 flip-flops be rediscovered in the Republican closets, dusted off, and worn to rallies.

Aug. 05 2008 10:02 AM
Chris from NJ

We should build nuclear plants to bridge the gap between fossil fuels and renewable energy. We've even got a place to store the waste now.

Aug. 05 2008 08:48 AM
Chris from NJ

I agree with Josh. Fund new energies, but use what oil we have in the meantime. There are ways to capture the CO2 that you create.

Aug. 05 2008 08:47 AM
Josh Levine

as long as there's a manhattan project on new energies underway -- i have NO PROBLEM with offshore drilling.

i object to the "looking for change" strategy of paying this month's rent -- and counting on the same plan for next month.

Coming from someone who would be directly adversely impacted by the "drill where Gd put oil" norm.

Aug. 05 2008 08:32 AM

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