Crime is Movin' On Up

Thursday, July 24, 2008

Recent statistics show crime is movin’ on up to the Upper East Side, Greenwich Village, and other wealthy Manhattan neighborhoods. Senator Tom Duane of District 29 Manhattan, Eugene O’Donnell, Professor of Law and Police Science at John Jay College of Criminal Justice, and Brad Hoylman, Community Board 2 Chairman, talk about Manhattan’s crime spike.


Senator Tom Duane, Brad Hoylman and Eugene O'Donnell

Comments [55]

5-0 from Long Island

High end doorman buildings are rarely, if ever, burglarized. Burglaries tend to occur in walk-ups populated by young renters who've moved in from out of town, and who don't lock their doors and windows well. The main target is portable electronics, cash and jewelry. Burglars enter from the adjoining roofs of these buildings, from fire escape windows on the upper floors, and of course from the first floor.

Jul. 24 2008 12:35 PM
Roger G. from Park Slope

The city gets the police force it pays for, and now we're seeing this fact manifest itself.

Jul. 24 2008 12:31 PM
steven davis from New york

These are the facts: the crime spike that the New York Post wrote about is composed of a few dozen burglaries, in aggregate, throughout Manhattan. On the Upper East Side, for example, crime is down by over ten percent in virtually every other category this year... I see a bunch of hype.

Jul. 24 2008 12:29 PM
O from Forest Hills

I mean #48, someone moved the comments on me.

Jul. 24 2008 12:26 PM
M.O.P. from Bruknahm

Fool what you want? We stiflin them fools
Fool what you want? Your life or your jewels?
The rules, (back em down) next thing, (clap em down)
Respect mine we Brooklyn bound, (bound! now, (now!)

Them thugs you know, ain't friendly
Them jewels you rock, make em envy
You thinkin it's all good, you creep through a small hood

Jul. 24 2008 12:24 PM
O from Forest Hills

#47 :( please help me.

Jul. 24 2008 12:02 PM
O from Forest Hills

#47, I still don't get it. I need more intense methods of instruction.

I don't know what will work.

Jul. 24 2008 11:58 AM
Brian from Forest Hills

No 48: Call:

You local city council member


Not only will they have the answer, but they will have the solution

Jul. 24 2008 11:58 AM
Sam from Upper East Side

Are landlords required to have secure roof-top doors? My walk-up building has a door to the roof that cannot be closed and secured against entry from the outside.

Jul. 24 2008 11:44 AM
Brian from Forest Hills

Number 44: You are right, I didn't answer that question; sorry.

Burglary = trespass + intent to commit a crime therein

If the crime is a larceny (grand or petit), then the larceny is an element or part of the crime of burglary.

Robbery = larceny + force

It is petit or grand larceny done with force.

Got it?

Jul. 24 2008 11:42 AM
thatgirlinnewyork from manhattan

sally, there's a presence of people beyond christopher street. the earlier caller was right--the blocks surrounding christopher (includes grove, west 10th, washington, greenwich, etc.) are increasingly frequented by drug dealers and sometimes prostitutes. sure--"they" have nowhere to go (except the christopher st. pier area), but i don't think we're talking about area youth here.

Jul. 24 2008 11:35 AM
Brian from Forest Hills


§ 155.05 Larceny; defined

1. A person steals property and commits larceny when, with intent to deprive another of property or to appropriate the same to himself or to a third person, he wrongfully takes, obtains or withholds such property from an owner thereof.

Larceny is split into petit and grand:

Petit Larceny is the above of any type or value, though usually used for property of lesser value.

Grand larceny is taking property of a certain type (e.g., scientific material) or value (e.g., over $1,000)

Jul. 24 2008 11:35 AM
O from Forest Hills

#42, but you didn't answer my question about grand larceny, is that considered robbery or burglary?

I just don't understand. Please explain.:)

Jul. 24 2008 11:31 AM
Beth from West Village

Many of the old rental residents have been replaced with a steady stream of transient tenants. The newbies don't bother to get to know their neighbors or their buildings (they're going to be moving on soon, rent is so high).

One of the first things the newbies do when they move in is remove the security bars to better enjoy their "Rear Window" views.

Jul. 24 2008 11:30 AM
Brian from Forest Hills

O: Here is the definitions straight out of the New York Penal Law:

New York Penal Law Section 160.00 Robbery; defined

Robbery is forcible stealing. A person forcibly steals property and commits robbery when, in the course of committing a larceny, he uses or threatens the immediate use of physical force upon another person for the purpose of:

1. Preventing or overcoming resistance to the taking of the property or to the retention thereof immediately after the taking; or

2. Compelling the owner of such property or another person to deliver up the property or to engage in other conduct which aids in the commission of the larceny.

New York Penal Law § 140.20 Burglary in the third degree

A person is guilty of burglary in the third degree when he knowingly enters or remains unlawfully in a building with intent to commit a crime therein.

Jul. 24 2008 11:28 AM
O from Forest Hills

$25k will buy you toilet paper and breakfast.

Jul. 24 2008 11:25 AM
World's Toughest Milkman from the_C_train

What cell phone carriers are these guys using?

Jul. 24 2008 11:25 AM
w from Manhattan

My friend got robbed recently in her neighborhood in Greenwich Village---she says there's a rash of attacks on women and gay men. One of our friends got beaten up so badly he needed reconstructive surgery. Also, my friend theorizes that the robbers are punks from NJ (car's license plate), and that their system seemed pretty sophisticated. This isn't going to stop anytime soon.

Jul. 24 2008 11:25 AM
Dana from Brooklyn

i dont agree with the last statement... there is no shortage of cops in the city -- on cell phones, joking around and loitering and doing not much of anything except maybe ticketing people for added revenue.

Jul. 24 2008 11:25 AM
sarah from Williamsburg


The cops told me the same thing, then they suggested that I go to the local pawn shops to ask around...unbelievable.

Jul. 24 2008 11:25 AM
Amy from Astoria, Queens

I live in Astoria, not really a wealthy neighborhood but definitely one that has been experiencing an influx of "new" residents.

My previous apartment was broken into while my roommate and I were both at work. The police had revealed there's been an increase of robbies similar to ours in the area.

While walking to the corner deli, I received a flyer from cops warning residents of the increase in gun crimes...I'm assuming they mean muggings.

This morning on my way to work I saw a car who's tires were stolen. The car was parked on a high traffic area...the thefts obviously had no concern about being seen by passerby’s.

Jul. 24 2008 11:24 AM
World's Toughest Milkman from the_C_train

I guess that $25K starting salary hasn't been helping the police force.

Jul. 24 2008 11:23 AM
Matt from Manhattan

Don't know it's much of a mystery why crime - especially in those kinds of neighborhoods would go up. There has to be a bigger disparity in how much the richer neighborhoods have and how much the lower income ones do.

Jul. 24 2008 11:23 AM
veronica from manhattan

Yes, let just lock ourselves in...and not address the harder topics of economic and policy issues that create crime in the first place.

I can't believe the emphasis in this segment.

Jul. 24 2008 11:23 AM
Sally Forth from Soho

Christopher street "elements"

What you are talking about is young gay black and latinos. These kids have no where else to go.

Jul. 24 2008 11:23 AM

Any correlation between rising prices with food and fuel - to these crimes?

Jul. 24 2008 11:21 AM
jon O

Burglars don't come to C. Gardens. Not unless they want to get a beating from the local enforcers. Crime here is only permitted when the locals allow it.

Jul. 24 2008 11:20 AM
Robey Clark

No one can do anything about the breathing?

Jul. 24 2008 11:20 AM
Katrina from New Jersey

In my town (don't want to say where because lots of homes are for sale!) we've had two burglaries in a week on my street in a high-income town in NJ, and I've heard of a rape here too. This in a town where a car being broken into is a big deal. I'm worried about the brashness of the burglar - he went in in the middle of the day, in a well-populated area and knocked on doors until he found one where no one answered, then broke in. Crazy.

Also, please note (and I'm surprised your lawyer didn't correct the speaker) that robbery is taking by force from a person; burglary is breaking in and entering and taking without force upon the person. A mugging is a robbery because it is one person taking from another person directly, not because it is outside!

Jul. 24 2008 11:19 AM
Leshka from UES

Great doors with good locks (as in my building) do no good if the tenants decide not to make sure the door shuts behind them.

Also, there are too many people who wait around to try to get in when a legitamate tenant opens the door. It's happened to me a few times with people who want to drop off menus. No matter what I do, they'll get in anyway. Again, no system will help if someone really wants to get in a building.

Jul. 24 2008 11:19 AM
Bethany from NYC

please- someone turn down the microphone of the person that is heavy breathing in the background into it right now. it is annoying and gross.

Jul. 24 2008 11:18 AM
exlege from brooklyn

can you get this guest to stop breathing into the phone?

Jul. 24 2008 11:18 AM
Brendan Roche from Williamsburg

In Williamsburg daytime burgerlies are easily committed because the great deal of construction. A breaking window sounds a lot like construction noise and therefore doesn't bring as much attention.

Jul. 24 2008 11:18 AM
ken from park slope

burglary occurred this past Sunday evening on Park Place between 5th and 6th aves - while family was out to dinner. burglar kicked in front door to 2 family house at about 7pm - brazen... he got spooked hearing voices on street and left taking only a tool box. and caught yesterday breaking into another house in neighborhood and burglar was then ID'd by neighbor from here.

feels like it's getting worse here...

PS - Hi Brad - (he's good friends with my wife, Katherine...) ;)

Jul. 24 2008 11:18 AM
RC from queens

What about the idea of "inside jobs."

Could the burglars be people who have good knowledge about the victim? Think about it, we have a lot of apartment buildings, credit card payments etc.. its probably easier more than ever to get information about you.

As a result you can get a sense of what someone may have in their homes?

So what about being more careful about protecting your identity and watching where you spend your money?

Jul. 24 2008 11:18 AM
Crystalle from Brooklyn

Williamsburg! 4 years ago I had my brand new Vespa stolen, then my car trunk was robbed (containing bags for a weekend trip), then just last year our apt. was broken into while we were out after having a dinner party. The burglars stole cameras, laptops and Ipods and when the cops came they said there's be almost no chance of catching the crooks.
Scary stuff.

Jul. 24 2008 11:18 AM
robert from park slope

Burglars are sometimes the low end of organized crime (burglars need a network through which to sell stolen goods). Are we seeing a resurgence in organized crime?

Jul. 24 2008 11:17 AM
Chelsea from NYC

I live in a first floor apartment and there aren't any welded bars on my windows, just little adjustable bars I put on from the inside (that dont seem like they would really prevent much) Is this legal, or is my lanlord required to put bars on?

Jul. 24 2008 11:17 AM
ross from LES

It's not the economy??? Consider how many manhole covers have gone missing across U.S. cities this year.
Given enough time, they'd probably burgle all the copper wiring from your apartment too.

Jul. 24 2008 11:17 AM
Anne Marie from Greenwich Village

Crime is way up in my neighborhood in Greenwich Village. Within a block, we have had multiple burglaries and muggings, including the high-profile mugging of NBC newsman Jay DeDapper. The other morning at 9:30 AM a woman was stabbed because she didn't give her wallet to muggers fast enough.

The 6th Precinct is drastically undermanned and many of the cops they do have are fresh out of the academy. While the new commander is great, he is working with minimal forces.

Jul. 24 2008 11:17 AM
Chris L

There has been a marked increase in the number of thugs in our neighborhood. I've seen drug deals happen in the little park and it's really stressful to suddenly live with that presence in the neighborhood in midtown east.

Jul. 24 2008 11:16 AM
O from Forest Hills

How does grand larceny factor in? Considered a robbery?

Jul. 24 2008 11:15 AM
sarah from Williamsburg

Consider it what you will, but us newbies are more affluent then the local community in Williamsburg and it's becoming know as the place to rob rich kids. About two months ago my work studio got broken into (through a gated & pad locked window) seems to be the trend around here.

Jul. 24 2008 11:14 AM
John Celardo from Fanwood, NJ

My wife found an interesting and relevant Website that gives you a map flagged with people in your neighborhood that have criminal records. The Website is

Jul. 24 2008 11:14 AM
RC from queens

Is there a difference in burglaries between those in elevator/doorman buildings and walk ups?

What about what floor are you on?

Jul. 24 2008 11:14 AM
O from Forest Hills

#9 is that in the NY Penal Law? I don't recall seeing that one.

Jul. 24 2008 11:13 AM
O from Forest Hills

As someone interested in Criminal Law, I appreciate these segments that you have on the show, Brian.

Thank you.

Jul. 24 2008 11:12 AM
Brian from Forest Hills


ROBBERY: Forceful stealing (e.g., taking property from a person on the street)

BURGLARY: Trespass with the intent to commit a crime therein (e.g., steal property)

Jul. 24 2008 11:11 AM
chris o from New York City

Just to clarify burglary vs. robbery: robbery happens in person, when someone steals something from you and you are physically threatened at the same time; burglary is when something gets stolen without the physical threat, without being there; so you can be robbed in your home, if you are there; if you are not there, you were burgled.

Jul. 24 2008 11:10 AM
Steve (the other one) from Manhattan

Criminals aren't stupid - the good stuff is on the Upper East and Upper West Sides. Who was it that said he robbed banks because that's where they kept the money?

Jul. 24 2008 11:10 AM
RC from queens

Does this mean that rents and real estate prices will come down?

A friend of mine believes that until the Wall Street broker/banker type, The Sex and the City wannabe is regularly mugged, rents in Manhattan will still be high and condo and coop prices will also be high.

Jul. 24 2008 10:48 AM
mc from manhattan

Why is it always "news" when the wealthier hoods have spikes in crime? I guess we use these stats as an indicator on how "well" the city/nation is doing and decided crime in less well off hoods is the norm and therefore is nothing newsy. How about a piece on what can be done on lowering crime in already high crime areas, rather than focusing on those areas where it's lesser an issue by comparison.

Jul. 24 2008 10:44 AM
Lil' Fame from Brownsville

Take rings off! Take chains off!

Jul. 24 2008 10:34 AM

The revolution has begun and it will be televised. CAN YOU DIGG IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jul. 24 2008 10:13 AM
Claudia from East 85th Street, NYC

I have heard of several violent assaults on women in my neighborhood. I have seen visible police presence on the street after dark - last night there were foot patrols on Madison.

Jul. 24 2008 09:51 AM

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