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David Sanger on the Obama Doctrine

Tuesday, February 28, 2012

David Sanger, chief Washington correspondent at the New York Times and contributor to WNYC, discusses the Obama doctrine--and how it applies to Syria, Iran, and Israel. 

David Sanger chief Washington correspondent at the New York Times and 
contributor to WNYCchief Washington correspondent at the New York Times and contributor to WNYC, discusses the Obama Doctrine--and how it applies to Syria, Iran, and Israel.

Guests:

David Sanger

Comments [28]

Iran, unlike Israel, is a signatory to the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty and allows IAEA inspections.

Israel is NOT a signatory.

Feb. 28 2012 08:12 PM
rose-ellen from jackson hts.

prior to vatican 2-the nuns taught me-in a catholic school in bklyn., that better to die or kill then let a consecrated Host touch the ground.if we were invaded and occupied by a muslim army and their soldiers burned our bible or our constituion we would be doing the same thing as the afghans.occupied europe and japan was peacful because world war 2 was about fighting military regimes where when the generals or the emperor surrendered,the troops surrendered with him and that was the end of the war. here[similar to viet nam] we're fighting the people -not simply a top down regime with their military and- defeat the military- and you end the war.[the people surrender with the troops] This feigned indignation about the afghan reaction to koran burning is part of our false narrative. We have our own fighting words and we also have people here and in europe who deliberatly want to burn korans and do want to incite a war against islam.The backward afghans know this too.This tells me perhaps there was a mole who deliberately had the korans burned or deliberately leaked the story to start a war between muslims and the west.That hamas and alquada side with the people against the murdering assad dictatorship and for that reason we will allow this holocaust to continue-tells me we are comlicit with mass murderers. Instead of recognizig that our narrative about alquada and hamas has been inaccurate-they are not pure evil but against tyranies and on the side of the people-we cling to simplistic good vs.evil narrative about them and would rather see a mass murderer go unstopped then admit alquada and hamas are om the right side this time.Lies that life is black and white.How we can stand by and come up with rationales to not stop a murderer we called part of the axis of evil when we wanted to start a war in iraq and now that the people themselves have risen up against this evil we do nothing? what ever label you give to the people rising up against this dictatoo is irrelevant to the reality that they are men women and children being massacred en masse for a year now.Where is our humanity-how can we call ourselves defenfers of human rights and compassonate people against oppression as we do nothing?

Feb. 28 2012 06:12 PM
gary from queens

Muslims in the world desacrate the Amer flag every day, many times a day. And there have been no reported dead muslims in the US as a result.

Here's what i would do to psychologically desensitize muslims who go Nicholas Cage crazy over the Koran, or any criticism of Islam:

I would print the text of the koran and distribute it free to everyone in the world.

Each page would be printed on one square of double ply toilet paper. you could fit an entire Koran on one roll!

Do you see how my useful my degree in psychology can be?!

But that's just me: Always looking to help my fellow man.

Feb. 28 2012 10:56 AM
gary from queens

That's it! Let's get the hell out of there NOW!

I'm sure David Sanger feels Obama should have apologized in 3 pages of Arabic, as he ordered his general to do. Yes, that must have been our mistake!

Unfortunately, Obama is smarter than that. he knows that if he allows Americans to be prosecuted by Muslims under sharia law, as NATO wants, he's toast for the Nov elections.

But Obama wasn't smart enough to realize that one apology to muslims always leads to more demands. It never placates. because obama never received the education I received growing up in the projects. he's not from the Hood. he's from elite liberal schools. Appeasement never works. Not with cowardly and intolerant Muslim bullies.

And do you REALLY want to vomit? Read item 5 below. THIS IS NOT A HOAX. This is what NATO (ie the Dhimmis of EUROPE) officially proposes:

QUOTE
5. The delegations also want from the Afghan government to formally praise those brave Afghan army soldiers and all others who showed feelings against the disrespectful act by preventing more religious books and Quran copies from burning, so that the pure Muslim sentiments of our honored Mujahid nation can remain alive.
UNQUOTE

Yes, like the "feelings" some showed by killing and maiming American soldiers.

David Sanger, you're the expert on Afghan "feelings". Tell us what to do? I say we prosecute those prisoners who defaced those korans---under their own sharia law. Then get the hell out of there if we're not going to fight this like a real war.

And let's go to the UN and declare that the mass murders in response to the burning of a dozen defaced korans, paid for by american taxpayers to serve the religious needs of detainees, are a "disproportionate response." That's the language of those damn diplomats there. let's get them on the record too while we're at it. Mass murder is a disproportionate response! These Muslim citizens (not even al qaeda!) in Afghanistan INTENDED to kill. (Unlike Israeli collateral damage in defending itself.)

http://www.gmic.gov.af/english/index.php/features/255--joint-statement-by-the-delegations-assigned-to-probe-bagram-incident

Feb. 28 2012 10:47 AM
gary from queens

Obama is not the sole apologetic dhimmi in the US government.

I could not have possibly made this more outrageous, if I had made it all up.

This is the worst case of it's kind, just in part because it was between an atheist and a Muslim, as opposed to between two Muslim family members. (usually a spouse or daughter versus the devout muslim father who kills them, etc. etc.)

AND we have audio! Which was in violation of the judge's order, who wanted to keep this proceeding secret by not allowing a court reporter to record the trial.

So be careful the next time you want to criticize Islam in the state of PA, and think that your First Amendment right to free speech will protect you from assault. IT WILL NOT. This obedient dhimmi judge has seen to that.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/291881/sharia-court-pennsylvania-andrew-c-mccarthy

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/291921/sharia-court-pennsylvania-transcript-andrew-c-mccarthy

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/291963/be-or-not-be-muslim-andrew-c-mccarthy

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/291964/does-judge-martins-not-being-muslim-change-bias-argument-andrew-c-mccarthy

Feb. 28 2012 10:42 AM
William from Manhattan

"Das war ein vorspiel nur wo man Bücher verbrennt, verbrennt man am Ende auch Menschen" ("Where they burn books, they ultimately burn people") - Heinrich Heine (engraved at Bebelplatz, Berlin).

Feb. 28 2012 10:40 AM

Regardless the flavor, it's paper folded into a book!

LESS RELIGION, MORE BRAINS!!

Feb. 28 2012 10:33 AM
gary from queens

Nation building in a Muslim nations was a neocon experiment that failed. it WAS NOT the plan by many conservatives, like Andrew McCarthy, when we invaded. They just wanted to take down the regime. nation building was the Colin Powell agenda. The UN agenda. The stupid China Barn narrative. And the last three years of kicking in doors and drone attacks is OBAMA's policy now. This was the justified war in afghanistan that candidate Obama ran on!! That hard left, intellectual professor, muslim-loving president----who's NOT a muslim, we are reminded.

Feb. 28 2012 10:30 AM
William from Manhattan

I think it's disingenuous to say the Koran is "just a book" or "just paper" in the context of burning. Religious and nonreligious Christians would have legitimate concerns if a state began burning copies of the New Testament and religious and nonreligious Jews would have cause for concern if a state began burning copies of the Torah. As a secularist, I certainly have concerns about book burnings and what they represent.

Feb. 28 2012 10:29 AM

There are UN inspectors in Iran.

The same inspectors have NEVER been allowed into Israel.

NEVER.

Feb. 28 2012 10:26 AM
RJ from prospect hts

And what happened to the UN's "responsibility to protect"?

Feb. 28 2012 10:25 AM
JP from NYC

The Koran when I was a student of it many years ago, was explained to me that it is as religiously significant to Muslims as the Eucharist is to Orthodox Christians ( Catholics etc. who have sacraments) . That is the way it is viewed. It is G_ds presence. There are no concepts of sacraments in Islam except for the words from Mohamed. Now, I know it is wrong to kill people over an object, but religions have done this in the past and will continue.
So Brian you have given out wrong info. It's not just a book.

Feb. 28 2012 10:25 AM
RJ from prospect hts

questions: 1) If the Koran is just paper that lives are being sacrificed for, aren't Afghanistan, Israel, India/Pakistan, Colombia just earth that lives are being sacrificed for? That question opens a significant pandora's box. Does Sanger really believe that was the point of the idiot "minister" in FL? His own statements were that Islam is not a religion and this was the sensitive symbol and any non-idiot would know that burning it would set off an uproar.

Feb. 28 2012 10:24 AM

David, why is the New York Times consistently promoting war? From Judith Miller to the current circumstance regarding Iran. Continual hawkish cheerleading.

Feb. 28 2012 10:23 AM
Jenna from LES

THANK YOU GUEST! He is one of the few people saying that it is impossible for Iran to attack the US with a Nuclear Weapon.

Israel can defend herself! Americans want to nation build here.

Feb. 28 2012 10:23 AM

For ten years — ten years — Israeli conservatives have been saying that "Iran is months away from a nuclear weapon." This is _easily_ checked, but for some reason nobody at NPR or the New York Times is willing to do this very simple review of news reports, etc. There was speculation about an Israeli or American attack on Iran in the 2008 campaign. Israel and the US have been rattling sabres over Iran for years.

Feb. 28 2012 10:22 AM
john from office

Interesting how this ties into Ray Kelly and the monitoring of Islamic groups here. Folks, people are being killed over the burning of a book, the irrational thought here is breathtaking. How can we think that these people here are not a threat??

Islam is still in the middle ages, needs to come into the present.

Feb. 28 2012 10:22 AM
gary from queens

Krautman once referred to Afghanistan as a "backwater" compared to iraq. Meaning that iraq at least had wealth (oil and gas) we can deny the jihadists.

But we allowed ourselves to be suckered by Colin Powell's and Obama's stupid idea that we could fix what we broke. Maybe in iraq, it was possible. But not with the light touch we used. A secular constitution should have been imposed on these religious fanatics, or else leave them in the rubble. We did neither. We chose the worst of all options.

And this story shows what that option yielded. This is what happens when you close your eyes to Islam, and call it the religion of peace.

Of Course Sharia Is Compatible with Western Democracy!
December 1, 2011 7:34 P.M.
By Andrew C. McCarthy

From here at the hysterical, irrational Islamophobe corner of the Corner, I pass along this cheery AP report
http://news.yahoo.com/afghan-president-pardons-imprisoned-rape-victim-170236330.html

from the sharia “democracy” we are building in Afghanistan, governed by a constitution that the State Department helped write:
http://old.nationalreview.com/mccarthy/mccarthy200603270613.asp

QUOTE
Afghan president pardons imprisoned rape victim

KABUL, Afghanistan (AP) — Afghan President Hamid Karzai on Thursday pardoned an Afghan woman serving a 12-year prison sentence for having sex out of wedlock after she was raped by a relative.

Karzai’s office said in a statement that the woman and her attacker have agreed to marry. That would reverse an earlier decision by the 19-year-old woman, who had previously refused a judge’s offer of freedom if she agreed to marry the rapist.

Her plight was highlighted in a documentary that the European Union blocked because it feared the women featured in the film would be in danger if it were shown.

More than 5,000 people recently signed a petition urging Karzai to release the woman. She had the man’s child while in prison and raised her daughter behind bars, which is common among women imprisoned in Afghanistan. [ACM - A woman doesn't have to be in a prison to be "imprisoned in Afghanistan."]

… The woman told The Associated Press in an interview last month that she had hoped that attention generated by the EU film might help her get released. With the film blocked, she said that she was losing hope and considering marrying her rapist as a way out. She said her attacker was pressuring her to stop giving interviews.

About half of the 300 to 400 women jailed in Afghanistan are imprisoned for so-called “moral crimes” such as sex outside marriage, or running away from their husbands, according to reports by the United Nations and research organizations. Fleeing husbands isn’t considered a crime in Afghanistan.

The EU welcomed the woman’s release.
UNQUOTE

Feb. 28 2012 10:21 AM
Amy from Manhattan

On the quote from Sec'y. Clinton, has Hamas (so far) done more than verbally express support for the opposition in Syria (switching sides, btw, from supporting Assad's gov't.)? Does it actually have people in Syria in whose hands arms supplied by the US could end up? How much of a presence does al-Qaeda have in Syria?

Feb. 28 2012 10:19 AM

Perhaps Brian Lehrer needs a refresher on what Americans like New York Times editors, members of Congress, and NPR commentators have advocated in the past in response to burning the US flag -- just a piece of cloth.

Feb. 28 2012 10:19 AM
John A.

Please say something about the extrajudiciality of drone strikes.
That part looks too much like Bush administration.

Feb. 28 2012 10:17 AM
gary from queens

Best article on the foolishness and outrageousness of the apology:

Why Apologize to Afghanistan?
The reaction to an accidental Koran-burning was inexcusable.

By Andrew C. McCarthy
FEBRUARY 25, 2012 4:00 A.M.

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/291925/why-apologize-afghanistan-andrew-c-mccarthy

Feb. 28 2012 10:17 AM

oil...syria must nt be important to us getting all the oil

Feb. 28 2012 10:16 AM

It scares me that I was thinking the same way about the US presence in Afghanistan as Newt Gingrich.

Feb. 28 2012 10:15 AM
gary from queens


Hilary didnt seem to have any problem arming al qaeda rebel elements in Libya.

Feb. 28 2012 10:12 AM
Kat Smith from Brooklyn, NY

Those questions from Secretary of State Clinton are good ones - except, where was that caution in Libya last year? What sort of viable opposition was there in that country? Did we even know? In Syria the suffering has gone on far longer and has been many degrees worse and yet, this public handwringing goes on and on. The opportunity to, as they say, "take out" Quadaffi was apparently irresistible - in Syria, not so much.

Feb. 28 2012 10:12 AM
Elle

I could not agree with Sec. Clinton more - we need to stay the heck out of Syria.

Feb. 28 2012 10:09 AM

see its a terrible terrible thing but what Clinton says is right...we made mistakes in egypt, Lybia etal ...diplomacy diplomacy diplomacy, not billions and arms

Feb. 28 2012 10:09 AM

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