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Out of the Shadows
Terrie Williams, author of
Black Pain: It Just Looks Like We're Not Hurting talks about her book, and PBS's upcoming special Depression: Out of the Shadows.
EVENT: Terrie Williams will be participating in a panel discussion alongside Larkin McPhee, director of Depression: Out of the Shadows, this Thursday at 7:30 at The Marjorie S. Deane Little Theater at the West Side YMCA (5 West 63rd Street). Event is free - for more information call 212-981-5298.
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Comments
strange that there is no word for depression in some Asian languages when the suicide rate is so high in Japan.
great start out with a gang member and try to ellicit sympathy...
sounds like a great show...enjoy it people while i change the channel...another great victim show..poor us
Most psychologists and counselors are white and have very little understanding of other cultures. When you go to them, they make suggestions that are just SOOO out there culturally, that one does not want to go back.
Talk about Stigma indeed Brian. Although, I respect your opinion Terri, I will say that I am black. Nigerian parents, American born, and no one I know would EVER prefer to speak of a ‘cousin in jail’ over a mentally sick familiy member. Please know that you cannot generalize all ‘black’ people.
Oh, stop, peoples.
Let's put aside our backlash anti- "victim-mentality" bias(right -- victim-mentality is a drag; but there still actually are real victims), and allow Ms. Williams a chance to address depression's racially specific stigma.
Clinical depression is, to a degree, universally stigmatized (for reasons too complex to address here), whether we care to admit it or not. And while there may be no way around this unfortunate fact, that doesn't mean we can't/shouldn't talk about it.
Many people that have a mental illness are born with it. Mental illness knows no race, color or creed…. It’s not just a minority thing and it’s not socially expectable of any race. Would you write on your resume that your bi-polar and expect to get any job no matter what color you are? Of course not. Society as a whole has a very long way to go as far as acceptance goes. Its very difficult if you have a mental illness no matter who you are. Please stop making it a race thing and fight the good fight for all who suffer.
This all sounds VERY anecdotal and unprofessional. Especially when she uses terms like "black folks", and all of this all-inclusive, blanket phrasing like "we do this" and "we do that".
And I think saying that African-American suspicion of medicine (if indeed there is such an endemic fear in the black community) is due to the Tuskegee experiments seems ridiculous. I mean, that's not to downplay how awful they were, but I don't think people say "I would go to a doctor, but they'll probably do secret experiments on me..."
I heard this psychologist on the radio and was very moved:
http://www.posttraumaticslavesyndrome.com/drleary.html
I also read that in England the first generation of black immigrants (from Jamaica, I think) did fine but their descendents had unexpectedly high rates of schizophrenia which experts attributed to growing up in a society that was very prejudiced against minorities.
Bringing people like Bloods gang members, Tyson, and 50-cent into this as the poster children for depression isn't that helpful, in my opinion...these individuals are all of adult age and have to take responsibility for their behaviors.
Depression and the need for acknowledgment and treatment are very real, but there is a need to be careful that this isn't just another rationalization to defend bad behavior...why not feature the many normal law-abiding people who struggle with this?
I'm Latino and I constantly have to wear "nice" clothes to get respect, or not be treated as a miscreant, esp. from the African Americans, e.g. Security Guards, retail sales people, library clerks. Point being that, in my experience, the African-Americans are only receptive to people who are Caucasian, in suits or has the perception being a successful person, thus the African-Americans wear nice clothings to be also treated with such respect. If people would only treat people as who they are and not what they wear or what they do, then maybe there's no reason to "mask" our identity to be treated with respect -- treat people the same way you want them to treat you.
What about a show for white people who are contstantly given 'attitude' by blck people (not all) for nothing...
it gets OLD...
Keith said therapy was taking too long. Aren't there some shorter-term types of therapy that might be more suitable for people who feel that way?
What about anyone who is 'different' from everyone else and why do they get depressed? How about short people and why they get depressed? What about old people and why do they get depressed?
why is a black person focused on here? Ans. because it is politically correct.
Why don't you do a show on how affirmative action and school programs since Johnson's Great Society have failed and made schools in black communities worse, in the last 40 years?
I think the cultural disparity between therapist and patient is significant. I have a friend who is Latina, and she really wanted a hispanic therapist because she felt explaining her culture as a preface to dealing with each of her issues would just be terribly exhausting. I do think it's hard for people of another culture to "get" certain things that someone from within the culture would just take for granted.
On some level, you want someone who has a different perspective to challenge your views, but on the other hand, it can become a drag.
I am a white woman and I get suspicious looks too from business owners all the time.
I think probably a LOT of people do despite what color they are or generally what they are wearing...
Do I get sick of it? yes...
I think it is the culture we live in...
Everyone is afraid of everyone unless they can read them down to a t...
It can make me a little peeved if some mother walking her child looks at me like I am a threat to her child, like I am a junkie, but we have a crazy society and in part I understand...
It DOES make me want to shout out how much I make at the mother or security guard etc...
argh..
quinticire,
You could switch Latino with African American in your comment and it would be true as well.
Glenn,
Short people are not the descendants of slaves.
Look at all of you... African Americans want to talk about depression in their community for a few minutes and it becomes an "opportunity" to chastize us and diminish a real problem in the community that affects the greater community.
You are pathetic and ugly people
awm,
I think when callers are talking about how their depression stems from how people perceive them in walking in stores and how they are dressed and the air of suspicion, it is perfectly reasonable to share a relevant position.
I have often told black people when hearing them complain that the security guide was following them, scoping them out, etc..that they are NOT always being scoped because they are black..it is their job...
The same thing goes with sidewalk etiquette..
People can appear a little alert with anyone walking down the sidewalk...
But yes, it is reasonable to be extra alert if someone is walking down the sidewalk regaled in gangster gear...or appears in any way similar to a miscreant...white or black or latino or asian, etc...
There is a time to navel-gaze but interjection should be welcome too...
Think about how difficult it is to talk about women's matters....
et,
Thanks! Problem solved. You should travel the country and let everyone know that their perceptions aren't valid because you can't relate to them.
Adria in Washington Heights writes: "Most psychologists and counselors are white and have very little understanding of other cultures. When you go to them, they make suggestions that are just SOOO out there culturally, that one does not want to go back."
I am white. I went into a Mexican restaurant in the West Village with my (also white) girlfriend. It was early and we were the first people to sit down. I asked the Mexican waiter for a wine list and my girlfriend asked him where the restroom was. She left for the restroom, the waiter left to get the wine list and I got up to check our coats. When I returned to the table, there was a group of a dozen young Black men were sitting at an adjacent table. My girlfriend returned shortly and the waiter arrived with a pitcher of water and the wine list. One of the young Black men objected loudly that we were being served first because we were white. Seconds later, another Mexican waiter brought two pitchers of water to their table and asked whether they'd like to order drinks. By this time they were all talking loudly about the racism of the staff and a standoff ensued between the Mexican kitchen staff and the dozen young Black men, who left after throwing the two pitchers of water around the dining room. If any of these dozen young men ever sought therapy, would this be one of the many slights suffered on a daily basis? Perhaps the white people aren't the only ones who are clueless.
awm,
One of my black friends, a guy, would discuss his difficulties with the racism he felt black people have towards white people.
Yes, I think the black community needs to heal itself.
Another good book discussing blacks & mental health is Standing In the Shadows: Understanding and Overcoming Depression in Black Men by John Head, http://www.amazon.com/Standing-Shadows-Understanding-Overcoming-Depression/dp/0767913531/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1210607852&sr=8-1.
Mike,
Cluelessness is universal. The men in the restaurant are proof of this as is your useless post.
Yes, those guys we're dumb... but what does this have to do with the segment? What does your post have to do with the post you quoted?
How did this turn into a forum for you to vent about your Mexican restaurant trauma?
AWN,
The reason people are mad about it being a “black thing” is that mental illness is mental illness. It’s a host of very serious debilitating diseases that are equally stigmatized in society. No body walks down the street with a shirt on it that says “kiss me I’m schizophrenic”. I feel bad for the people on the show for what they are going through because of the depression they suffer, not the color of their skin. No body gets a free ride with society when it comes to acceptance of having a mental illness. So if you want to help the acceptance of mental illness in society, your not doing anybody any good by making it a “black thing” because like it or not it effects everybody.
I think the point of the show is talking about the progression of black people's acceptance of seeking treatment for mental health.
Much black-on-black violence probably do stem with individuals who have mental/psychological issues that become aggravated over time. Some repeat drug offenders are seaking unhealthy ways to self-medicate and to maintain that habit (burgarly, robbery).
That it is why it is very important to make sure, as early as possible, we catch kids who are acting out to help cope with whatever interbal conflicts they are dealing with before it results in more aggressive, anti-social behavior.
Now I want to say that not all black people deal with the effects poverty, crime, etc, but it is important we look out for each other because more than likely we will look for each for partnership.
Jon P.,
The point of customizing mental health education for black community is the same reason mental health education might be customized for the LGBT community, for the 1st-responders community, for the elderly community, etc.
Members of a certain demographic are more likely to help others in the same demographic when it comes to health issues so if enough people in that demographic buys into that seeking mental health is ok more than likey those members will encourage fellow members to seek out treatment.
Jon P.,
I don't think you truly listened to the segment
and I don't you're capable of doing so.
It was about how depression is percieved in the black community and that there should be a greater utilization of therapy by those who need it and avoid it because of stigma in that community.
You attributed the "black thing" aspect to it because you are limited by your myopic view of people who are not like you. You, like many in society (black, white, whatever) have a limited perspective.
This is an important and valid topic. Unfortunately your speaker of choice was not the best. The speaker needed to keep in mind who the listening audience is. The issue could have been presented and explained in a much better way so as to be better received and understood by a largely uninformed audience. Very disapointing...
Mental health education that is targeted to a demographic group does not mean that other people are excluded. Rather this is done to leverage existing community ties to disperse helpful information.
And as far as people having problem when topics are discuss concerning Black/African-American people, remember black people are a distinct cultural and demographic groups just like Asian Americans, Hispanic Americans, LGBT, elite-upper class, etc. Like America as a whole, black people are very diverse.
AWM,
"You are pathetic and ugly people"
You must be depressed. So much anger. What would you suggest be the solution?
I think that African-Americans who are depressed, or just simply depressed, are mostly self-inflicted. Everything is about them, they're being discriminated against by the Latinos, the staff at the Mexican restaurants, the whites, etc. And yet they are the ones who discriminate the most. Stop discriminating and perhaps the feeling of despair, helplessness, and hopelessness, which contributes to depression, would go away.
I had the pleasure of meeting Terrie once at a film screening for "Coach Carter" at the Director's Guild. She seems like a lovely woman and it came as a shock to me that she suffered from depression. I have been battling depression for many years, and am also African-American. I enjoyed the discussion from callers about their experiences with therapists, and in fact some of the experiences mirror my own. I have had three therapists -- all white women -- and with the exception of the last therapist, all had been wonderful and helped me gain insight, etc. Because I had been attending a City Hospital clinic, and my previous two therapists had left to have babies, etc., I didn't get the kind of continuity that I needed, and am still suffering from depression, but not sure what I should do about starting over yet again with another therapist. The City clinics are bad in that regard because the turnover rate seems especially high and/or the interns/residents eventually leave and the patients have to start over.
I loved Brian's contributions to the discussion. He has quite an insight into issues of race and culture and seems to be not racist at all.
AWN,
I have suffered from a mental illness for over 20 years now. How about you? Where did you get your insight from?
When I was in the hospital, I was with all race, color and creed in the psychiatric ward. We all had something in common, we were all in a place society called the loony bin. We all were extremely ashamed of being there because it’s known as the loony bin and the stigma that goes along with it. It’s a bad place to be no matter what color you are or how much perspective you think you may have. The stigma fallows you around no matter where you go. So my point is, mental illness is still stigmatized by everybody and should be approached that way.
fb,
I have my good days and bad days, but I tell it like it is everyday.
You have the nerve to ask me to post a solution to a problem that spans centuries and then offer up your simplistic garbage?
Your "they do this and they do that" argument is the work of a child.
Good luck with your way of seeing the world, I'm sure you have a full and productive life.
Jon P.,
I'm sorry for what you have had to deal with and I hope you are doing well. Now I that I know more about you and your life I better understand your perspective and the point you're trying to make. My apologies.
Take care.
AWN,
I do have the nerve to ask you what the solution is and judging by your “I’m better then thou” answer, you really don’t have any solutions but are real good at telling everyone else how you’re a real pompous ass…
AWN,
apologie accepted.
Thank you and keep an open mind in helping everyone with a metal illness.
Jon P,
"Pompous ass?"
I've been called worse. I don't pretend to have a solution for the problems that were the subject of this segment. They are vast and complicated. But this was an attempt to address and discuss the problem and I take offense to those who merely use it as an opportunity to vent about their personal gripes with the African American community. That is an opposite of a solution.
Paulo, google the book "Medical Apartheid."
In response to #17, when people think they know us better than we know ourselves, these are the reactions you get, AWN.
Actually, to present an obverse of some of the situations discussed above, I noticed a funny thing when I worked with African American staff in the hospital. They often had to work twice as hard with elderly white patients, because those white patients were so unreasonably distrustful of them. These staff members were excellent, and handled the situation with real grace. But in this case, the depressed elderly white patients were potentially contributing to the depression of the African American staff. It's all connected, and I think the guest has a point.
AWM replies "Cluelessness is universal. The men in the restaurant are proof of this as is your useless post. Yes, those guys we're dumb... but what does this have to do with the segment? What does your post have to do with the post you quoted? How did this turn into a forum for you to vent about your Mexican restaurant trauma?"
I was not tramatized, although the Mexicans may have been. The segment concerns the effect that racial slights have on the mental disposition of Black people. Many non-Black listeners are wondering how Black people can know that their perceived slights are the result of racism. It is the 800 lb gorilla in the room. Many Black people, yourself seemingly included, really have no answer to this, so your answer becomes simply denying the problem. Apparently cluelessness is universal.
To continue, I do not mean to deny that racial slights exist. Race and gender are part of every social interaction, but the Jim Crow south does not exist and racism and sexism are usually found in the nuances of behavior. Black people are just as capable and likely to dish it out as they are of receiving it. That does not mean that the segment has no value: Fewer White people must deal with a primarily Black social environment than Black people have to deal with a primarily White social environment. It doesn't take much to imagine that more Black people will be stressed out because of the racial climate than White people are, but some of that stress is imagined, not real. Should one of the goals of therapy be to put the patient more in touch with reality instead of simply constructing strategies for coping with a distorted reality? I think yes. I didn't see much acknowledgment of this during the segment or on the part of commenters like AWN.
This thread is closed.
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