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The Brian Lehrer Show
Transportation Meltdown
Wednesday, August 08, 2007
Did you make it to work this morning? If you did, it was no thanks to the MTA. Gridlock Sam aka Sam Schwartz, transportation engineer and Daily News columnist, sorts out why things went so horribly wrong with our public transportation system this morning.
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Comments
Could you please try to get local treasure, and Air America Radio host, Rachel Maddow on your show? She has been way ahead of the curve on the infrastructure issue for a long time. I remember a book from my college days called America in Ruins that addressed this.
Every subway station that I was in today had water pouring through, above gound and below ground stations. These stations often drip when it rains but I began to wonder what does all of the water mean to the structural integrity of these stops?
I lived in New York around 2000. Didn't the exact same thing happen to the subways then. There was 3 inches in 10 minutes and it basically shut the entire system down. Why is everyone so surprised?
This is very strange, I remember all the way back to the old rickety trains in the 1950s leftover from the '30s ('20s?) and I don't ever remember anything like this interruption in those days. I guess all the lack of infrastructure upkeep is coming to haunt us all at the same time. Add it to things you want to hear the candidates to talk about (bearing in mind all the while that that's about all they'll do is talk about it).
TORNADO WARNING!!!
At 7AM there was a tornado "warning". The weather service said a warning means that, unlike a "watch”, it could already be on the ground. They were tracking by the minute as it moved through our area.
To have the strap hanger guy on to say he was "disappointed is disingenuous at best and plain bad reporting.
This was an extraordinary weather event.
Please stop creating controversy where it is unwarranted.
I work as a Roads Engineer in Glasgow, Scotland.
Its clear that the New York infrastructure is not able to cope with the demands of 'some morning rain'.
As you will know, Scotland, UK, is a country famous for the amount of rainfall we get all year round. However in Scotland the surface is more like a sponge and the city's drainage is superb. Unlike New York, where there are no natural areas for water to penetrate due the density of the city. With this in mind there is a major need for an increase in the city's infrastructure!
Many thanks,
Great Show!
I was listening to WNYC this morning and at 8:00 when I left the house, there was no mention that most of the trains were down, only that a few lines and the commuter trains were affected. Brian Lehrer mentioned that the A train at 7:00 this morning was not going past 59th Street. Why weren't New Yorkers informed about the mess before they were right in the middle of it, stranded on a subway?
Can you please dedicate one hour to a serious conversation where you address who is really responsible and accountable for the public transit system in NYC and the Metropolitan Region? WNYC has failed to do that.
It took me almost 2 hours to get from Queens to Midtown today on the express bus I normally take for a normal trip of 25-40 minutes. I was the least affected compared to my co-workers and family.
It is unbelievable and unacceptable that a system that supposedly has received 10s of billions of dollars in capital improvements funded through debt and a 60% increase in fares has deteriorated to a point that every time it rains or there is an inch of snow many subway lines are not functional.
Not just this summer but in the prior two summers we have seen serious disruptions every time it rains.
Being a loyal listener of WNYC I am also upset that the station and NPR - one of the 2-3 independent media outlets in the whole state- do not focus on the accountability of the Mayor and Governor. THEY provide the budget. THEY appoint their political friends to the Board that runs and sets up strategy for the MTA. The taxpayer and commuter has NO way to influence or hold the MTA board accountable. Our only influence is through the Mayor and Governor yet reporting by WNYC and other outlets claims and insinuates that the MTA Board is an 'independent' authority. There have been many instances when WNYC along with other corporate media outlets in the City have dismissed anybody who tries to have a conversation about the accountability of the Governor and mayor or about the mismanagement of the agency.
How can this City be competitive when businesses in this City cannot rely - on a regular basis - on literally millions of workers to be at work on time?
You need to start putting pressure on these politicians. Because we as individual taxpayers and riders have no one to listen to us.
I'm thinking back to 9/11/07 when I never did hear the "this is an annoncement from the emergency brodacast system.
I'm thinking about the several occaissions when the city was beset by "unknown odors"
I'm wondering what we will do in the event of a bio-attack, a dirty bomb, a hurricane.
My observation during the peace march in march of 03 and during the RNC was that any police officer approached for information was working on the "get off of my corner" principle- they would tell you anything to keep you moving along.
During the Transit Strike my office was at 28th and 7th and it was damn near impossible to get to Penn Station.
Bloomberg made his fortune on information dissemination, one would think that he is the Mayor who could provide some real time real info.
NYC has ALWAYS had tropical Summers. I remember the OLD days in the 1980's when we had huge thunderstorms practically every afternoon and evening. We did not have the subway system collapse. As a taxpayer and as a commuter and person who cares about this City I am LIVID!
As a member and regular listener of WNYC I would like to see the station show some cojones and go on a blitz to get to the bottom of the following:
1. We have seen Pataki blanket the airwaves during his last reelection campaign about all the improvements made to the MTA - with MTA money. Why have we allowed MTA funds to be used for reelection campaigns?
2. We have seen the MTA claim a month later that it was running on a deficit when it was negotiation a cost of living raise for the union workers.
3. We have seen the MTA maintaining 2 sets of books - Why weren't the executives indicted? If this were a publicly traded corporation they would have been indicted.
4. We have seen hundreds of millions of dollars in cost overrun on the new MTA headquarters with millions going directly to organized crime? Why weren't MTA officials indicted?
5. We have seen monies made available by the Federal Government to improve security and safety underground not being used. Right now if there was an emergency there is not a working announcement system to safely evacuate people.
6. We have seen Pataki and Bloomberg ignore requests for independent auditors even when insiders have spoken out about mismanagement and corruption. Don't they have a fiduciary duty to make sure that public agencies under their control are properly managed?
7. We have seen valuable public, tax-payer owned MTA real estate given at reduced prices to politically connected real estate developers yet not have the 100's of millions for transportation improvements required by these development projects added to the public costs of these transactions. Why is the media hesitant to point out the deception of our politicians?
8. We have seen a tremendous increase in ridership yet have seen a decline in the amount of moneys provided by the state to maintain and improve the infraestructure. MTA riders are the least 'subsidized' riders in the country
i was happy to jump on my bike this morning and ride from harlem to chelsea past the thousands of people waiting for the bus
Hi Brian - I want us to have a plan B once the subways are down such as:
shared taxis
cars offering rides
commandeer sightseeing buses for the commuting hours
love your show
Harriet
I waited for over three hours to get on a 7 train to get here from Greenpoint. My whole neighborhood was shut down. What happens when we get hit by a hurricane or worse? Is the MTA ever going to get its act together?
Thanks to Heather who rented a zip car this morning when she heard about the trains and stopped to pick-up three of us standing on the curb, trying to hail a cab outside the West 4th Subway. I was shocked that no one seemed to be sharing cabs - every cab that flew by me had only one or two passengers. Kudos to Heather for her generosity!
I walked my wife to the Subway at Bergen & Flatbush and then joined the throng marching up Flatbush. The scene was amazing, it looked like a crowded sidewalk in Midtown and the street was overflowing with buses and cars all aiming for the bridges I guess. As people debate whether this points to infrastructure problems or not, it undeniably reveals how the state of public infrastructure affects everyone, whether they ride the subway or not. So, I don't know whether this particular incident points to poorly managed infrastructure or not, and I suspect any effort to blame could become mired in political posturing, but today should help us ALL realize that we ALL rely on our public infrastructure. We ALL have a stake in improving mass transit, and we ALL have a stake in reducing traffic congestion.
Scottish guy is right. We need better stormwater management in NY - more pervious surface to soak up water before it goes into the subway tunnels and storm drains.
Thank you to the last caller!!! Luckily I didn't have to take the subway this morning, but I'm glad you mentioned how INSANELY unorganized, apathetic and inaudible the underground MTA is.
A
Plan B: Buy a bicycle and ride safely. Don't depend on the MTA. They've consistently let strap hangers down.
Be aware of others around you.
Kudos to NJ Transit! I take the bus from Cliffside Park, south along the river to the Lincoln Tunnel. We had the normal flooding on River Road but otherwise made it in with no problems, the trip taking about 10 minutes longer than usual.
Being fourtunate enough to live in Manhattan, I ended up walking to work - 40 blocks on a steamy summer morning. I'm considering buying an old bike and forgoing the subway alltogether.
MMN
I reverse commute from Queens to Hawthorne nr. Tarrytown and it was a mess!! The Grand Central Parkway was terrible, the Van Wyck was terrible (but what's new), the Clearview (ha ha) was closed from the LIE to Northen (essentially closing the main passage to the Throgs Neck bridge). In the event a hurricane hit Queens I prey Senator Bruno can evaluate me on his helicopter, I'll talk politics too just to please Gov. Spitzer.
what is going to happen WHEN, not IF but WHEN a Hurricane(which we are long overdue for) hits the area? What will happen then in regards to "an emergency" This city is like an elderly person with osteoporosis about to be mugged. One storm of barely tropical depression strength and the city transit shuts down. We are in trouble!
One more note on tornados--
I grew up in the midwest, where we actually had tornado drills consistently in school- where you go down to the basement and sit knees-up, facing the wall, covering your head with your arms. I have witnessed twisters and the sky change to green and grey in a matter of seconds-- AND... in the midwest there are tornado warnings which are audible sirens indicating that there is a tornado in the vicinity, so that you can prepare. I realize tornados in NYC are rare, however, there must be some sort of an audible tornado warning for citizens.
And, going back to subway transportation meltdown-- it's not only the inaudible speaker systems and lack of communication to MILLIONS of people! It's also the old system infastructure that must also be to blame for not being able to withstand the rain.
Something must be done to rectify these problems.
I take the G from Brooklyn to Queens every day and, for the 3 years that I've been taking it, it has been oblivious to all the Manhattan and Brooklyn to Manhattan messes. Today, however, at Bergen Street in Brooklyn, they announced it was running on the F track to Manhattan. I chuckled to myself wondering whether the driver would get lost in Manhattan, because the G is a very simple route and the driver wouldn't be used to all the complicated manhattan switches. Anyway, it stopped at West 4th and that was it. But here's the thing, all the announcements that were made up to that point and later said, there is no this, no that, this train terminates at 59th street, etc. It was all completely negative. If they knew what wasn't running, didn't they know what was running? Couldn't they have said the A train is running or the C whatever? It's all in the communications.
BTW, I just heard your announcer list all the trains that weren't running, but he failed to mention the G train! Why????? I need to know if I can get home.
This situation points out the need to accelerate the upgrading of our "infrastructure". The problem with getting water out of the subway seems to be a question of where to put it. NYC sewers were unable to
handle the downpour, and in some places, notably downtown Manhattan, there are only sanitary sewers. That's o.k. -- we need to treat all of our waste water, even runoff -- but the capacity of the santiary sewer system is inadequate. We need upgrades.
And don't any politician or "expert" tell me it can't be done!
***********
One of your callers said he saw no news coverage. John DelGiorno of WABC Channel 7 flew over 58-59St btwn 6/7Ave and showed the roof ripped off at 10:10am. Check out the news or the web site.
If there was a tornado, there will be signs of trees and lamposts being twisted; if straight-line, trees will have been flattened down to the ground. (straight-line winds are usually a result of severe downdrafts, the kind that have downed airplanes in the past.) But some of your callers and WNYC news reports mentioned that "train-approaching" sound which always seems to precede a tornado. The National Weather Service will be the final determining agency in this case.
As per the discussion this morning about the tornado in Bay Ridge... check out the photos on flickr:
http://flickr.com/search/?q=brooklyn+tornado&m=text
I live in Bay Ridge and had no idea there had been a tornado. I wasn't that surprised to see people standing around outside the subway station this morning when I was trying to get to work because Bay Ridge, lovely as it is, is the lost, forgetten Stepchild when it comes to being connected to the rest of New York City, and 'yes' for all those won't-go-beyond-Manhattan snobs, Bay Ridge and the rest of Brooklyn, Queens, Staten Island, the Bronx, as well as Manhattan together make up the City of New York. C'mon my fellow Ridgers, you know we have it BAAAAD out there, the train is often slow or not running and after a certain hour (that sometimes seemed arbitrarily decided nightly by the MTA) the R train just stops running out of Manhattan and if you're not early enough, you're fooked! A long enough commute takes an hour and a half. I love the saftey of the neighborhood, the way the local people take care of each other, the small town feeling, the safety, I could do with a FEW more liberals, but I like that it isn't over-run with gentrifying snobs from anywhere other than New York, I think me being a transplant from Oregon to be enough, but the MTA seems to forget us on a regular basis.
ALSO, foreigners who visit are SHOCKED at how awful our city subway system is: it's unreliable but for a few lines, the staff are discourteous and unhelpful at best, the PA system is inaudible and there are only 1 or two maps per car and some stations don't even have them posted in the stations! We're the richest country in the world and NEw York City the headquarters of commerce and trade and we can't do better than this??
The total chaos of the subway this morning seems inconcievable in this day and age. I got off the LIRR in Penn this morning @ 7:10 am.I work on Third ave in the Bronx. No 1,2,or 3 service at that time. How did I know? The turnstiles had the red light on. No announcement or MTA employee other then the normal guy in the booth. At Penn?? I managed to get a A train to Times Square,then a 7 to Grand Central. The announcements were sporatic most everywhere. Contradictory at times too. Wound up on a M101 to 125th street and walked to work.
Folks on the bus were generally "good"(save for crowd that got on thru the back door and didn't pay)helping each other out. Folks need to learn to think on thier feet, and to adapt. Some of the panic and frustration that they experienced could have been avoided.
If 30% of NYC commuters traveled by bike, as in Copenhagen or Amsterdam, imagine how the day would have turned out differently.
1. Many more people would have been at work on time, regardless of the subways.
2. Buses would have been far better positioned to absorb extra commuters with no alternatives, because so many others would be using bikes.
3. With less need to manage crowd control, police and MTA officials could have prioritized resources to bring the subways back online asap.
System failures like this one show how bicycles are not just an environmentally friendly way to get around, but provide critical transit redundancy. If 30% of New Yorkers biked every day the pressure on our infrastructure would dramatically fall.
Critics will immediately shoot down this point by stating that New York is not a biking city.
But does it have to be that way? 30 yrs ago every public square in Copenhagen was a parking lot and the city prioritized the automobile every bit as much as New York does. Copenhagen got to where it is today through a steady reording of its transportation emphasis, placing pedestrians and cyclists at the top of the pyramid and the private auto at the bottom.
In New York we need a strong network of physically separated bike lanes, secure bike parking at the work place, and the integration of cycling and mass transit.
These are relatively inexpensive reforms that would complement the massive capital investments we need to make in our threadbare subways.
brian, i was worried about you getting to work. honestly, one of my first thoughts was how will brian & leonard get there in time for their programs? thank you for making the trip!
i had a 3.5 hour commute from inwood to the lower east side this morning. the most frustrating part of it for me was all the empty cabs driving around aimlessly refusing customers. we were all organized into groups to share cabs, but they kept refusing to take us (if they didn't want business, why didn't they just go home?). did they all suffer from some sort of sadistic impulses).
This thread is closed.
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