On Demand
Keep It Down!
Tuesday, July 03, 2007
Dr. Arline Bronzaft, chair of the noise committee of The Council on the Environment of New York City, explains NYC's new noise code.
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Most NYC highways don't have a sound wall around them but after the city line they are every where. Some exist near private homes but generally apartment dwellers are not protected in anyway. When the highway is expands that is lanes are added then the soil grass and trees are removed and so is any sound absorbing material that was designed into the road to begin with! Queens is awash in noise from highways,trains and aircraft. DeMato stopped the planes from taking off over Great Neck(federal law )I guess the millions of people in Queens don't have enough importance.
The MTA changed the Railroad ties from wood to concrete and raised the sound level a great deal and made no provisions to reduce the added noise that it brought to those near it. This made it impossible to open any window in direct line of site to the rr tracks in my apt in Rego Park.
The community board told me that since the MTA is an authority there is no hope of recourse!
It seems the limit to enforcement is the availability of meters. What sor of meters are required, can they be purchsed by citizens, and if properly calibrated, would they constitute evidence of violation (since by the time the rare meter arrives, the violation may be over)?
What, if anything, can be done about cars honking horns, for no apparent reason. I don't think any other city has this problem, not even LA where cars are king. Its impossbile to walk around midtown and not hear the constant honking of car horns.
Several decades ago when Chicago passed its noise abatement ordinance which included unnecessary honking of car horns, a media person asked a city official if there would be an exception for wedding parties driving down the street. the city official responded, "Only if the wedding is an emergency". We also had Mr. Softee in Chicago when I was growing up. I NEVER missed the jingle after noise abatement.
Whoa... I was just really suprised at the expert's implication that someone playing the radio loud would likely be involved in crime or drug dealing... isn't she making a HUGE overgeneralization???
I need some of the noise. Like that woman in Brooklyn I grew up on a main street in the Bronx with my bedroom on the ground floor apartment in the 50s where people banged on the then tin garbage cans under my window and traffic was all night an the fire engines from a block away blasted their way thru the streets overnight. Without the night noise I cannot fall asleep, that's my lullaby...odd as that may sound; I go insane when there's silence. That said I am happy I do not live above a club on the weekends. BTW how about the smell of food from restaurants? That's what offends me.
Robert
what about big trucks that like to honk their horns that should really only be on the highway! it makes me jump out of my skin in my apartment.
I live at the corner of 39th and Park. The auto honking is almost continuous all day long. There is a sign that says NO HONKING EXCEPT FOR EMERGENCY $350 Fine. What do these signs mean if no one enforces it?
I agree with the noise code for construction, and many of the cars. But I strongly disagree with the correlation of crime and noise.
the hissing high pitch and loud noise of the subway car. Everyday while commuting to Manhattan, on line 2-3-1, it is like an aggression everyday. How come nothing is done about it. Nowhere else (that i know of) in the world they let such dreadful noise.
The worst noises in my life in the city are police and fire sirens. I know the sirens are necessary. But they are excessive!
Can't the police and fire department limit the length, continuity, and loudness of this noise? I have to cover my ears and yell for mercy.
Professional classical musicians have problems living in New York City, since they must practice their music in order to earn their living. The "noise" they make while practicing inevitably bothers their neighbors. As someone who used to perform regularly on a brass instrument, I remember well the epithets that came flying through the walls of my apartment--directed at me. Yet, I had no where else to practice, and if I didn't practice, I couldn't work.
I used to sneak into schools and use their practice rooms, but ultimately, it was an unpleasant situation--for me and my neighbors.
One would think that a city with such a wonderful arts scene would have a place where musicians could practice their music and not annoy their neighbors.
The noise from a motorcycle is for the rider's safety more than anything else. It allerts nearby drivers that may not look thoroughly in their rear and side view mirrors that there is a motorcycle near them. Limiting that noise is a threat to public safety, which I believe is an important part of quality of life?
My biggest noise complaint in the city: CAT CALLS! From construction workers, delivery men, men who think it is their right to make inappropriate comments to women on the street. Can I call 311 for this?
Pleasae ask your guest to repeat her email address. Thank you.
--The BL Show responds:
The link is fixed now. Thanks for bringing it to our attention. Arline Bronzaft's (the guest) email address is albtor@aol.com.
The link to CENYC is broken. Can you also post the guest's email address here? Thanks.
There is a strong correlation between crime and loud car stereos, as documented in the Dept. of Justice COPS series of publications, police reports and media articles. Does it surpise anyone that people who have no regard for their fellow man are the same that disregard authority and law? If they were good citizens, they would observe the noise ordinance.
The myth of loud motorcycle noise increasing safety is a myth exposed by even motorcycle safety instructors, as the noise is only heard in areas where the danger does not exist (behind the cycle).
Finally, nobody (especially a sociopath) has the right to invade my home, my relaxation, my sleep, my intimacy, my prayers -- ever!
Hilda, the level is 42 decibels as measured inside your apartment, 3 feet from an open window. This is a very low noise level. If you hear it, it is almost certainly in violation. You can either try to get the NYC DEP to come out and measure (good luck!!) or take the hospital to court, but you would need to hire an acoustical consultant to document noise levels.
This guest was a racist. Stereotypes say that minorities play loud music in cars. Stereotypes say that minorities are more prone to crime. And now this new stereotype from your guest suggests that loud music listeners are criminals. What ignorance. Why would someone carrying drugs and guns draw as much attention to themselves as possible? That's just plain stupid. Rethink your subversive stereotypes, lady, they're rather offensive.
The new Noise Code will have virtually zero effect on the overall noise level in the City. It does not address the main source of noise in the City -- related to buses, horns, motorcycles, subway screeches (except to suggest "studies" (!) -- and provides no real improvement in the ability to enforce noise limits. Furthermore, the 3 decibel reduction worthless, since the old limits were not being enforced. This is an enforcement issue, not a Code problem.
I have a nearby hospital whose airconditioning is on a low, second-floor roof which is overwhelmingly loud. What is the decibel level that is legally acceptable?
What about the people who blast their stereos at volume 11? I pay rent for where I live so I should have the right to be able to watch my TV without some scumbag blasting his stereo at ridiculous levels in which he may as well be in my apoartment.
That is DEFINITELY a law enforcement issue.
Among the many oversites of this study, it fails to take into account the cultural profiling that can result from such policies. New York is a mixing bowl and it doesn't take much fore thought to think which communities will receive unjust attention.
Re: noise levels which I'd like to see eliminated, but which seems to be an increasing social issue which I've never seen discussed publically.
Little kids, even babies in strollers, are allowed by parents to literally scream recreationally in supermarkets, malls, etc.
Parents are apparently inured to the high pitched noise these small lungs produce. I've actually walked out of restaurants because small kids are allowed to leave their parents' tables and run around screaming & throwing food about. No one seems to notice or complain to the parents. Any suggestions from your listeners or am I turning into a cranky old lady? I fear a generation of narcissistic, inconsiderate future adults is being raised.
First of all, the comment by Dr. Bronzaft regarding immigrant neighborhoods and how they need to assimilate to America's 'quiet culture' was ignorant and off color and implies that Americans don't want to see or here those differences.
A major point regarding the neighborhood noise issue is centered around the living conditions in these neighborhoods. In general, lower class immigrant communities have denser population levels and thus make more noise. Living in tight quarters leads people to move their activities outside in nice weather; apartment buildings in these communities with many units are not equipped with sound proofing to block the activities of lots of people. I believe this new code ignorantly and irresponsibly targets these types of neighborhoods. A Park Slope stockbroker blasting The Rolling Stones in the depths of his/her brownstone will not foster a noise complaint; think of who will.
For those who are arguing that it is racist to argue that there is a correlation between crime and noise, I have to ask; who, with a legitimate job, can afford to be out blaring their stereo until 3 and 4am on regular weeknights?
I am a (non-Hispanic) minority, and live in a predominantely Hispanic neighborhood. Maybe it's a cultral difference, but people seem to have a keen, and inflated sense of their own supposed "rights," but completey lack an understanding of (or refuse to acknowledge) the rights of other people.
I understand that someone may want to listen to music while they drive. But, why must it be so loud that it sets off every single car alarm on the street? Or that people may want to gather with friends on their stoop from time to time. But, why must it be 6 nights a week, and why blast your stereo whenever "your song" comes on? That your kids might want to play outside and ride their bicycles. But, why must they do so a 1:00 am while screaming at the top of their lungs? And why must you honk your horn, or scream from the street to your friend's apartment, because you can;t be bothered to either call them on your cell phone or ring their doorbell?
I think the absolute prize was a woman who sat in a car in front of my street for 12 minutes blaring her horn. It was about 10:00am on a Saturday, and I was thankfully already up and getting ready to leave the house. I came downstairs to find that she was behind an ambulance that was loading a patient. Once the patient was loaded (with the woman still honking) and the ambulance departed, she proceeded 20 feet to the end of the block and parked.
Noise laws should be enforced in all areas. It's just a shame that people in minority areas sometimes seem to have no respect for each other.
On noise:
I ride into B'klyn via the FDR and it's horrible to be stuck in bumper-to-bumper traffic next to someone who has his car stereo pumped up so that, even with my windows closed, the sound and vibration come right into the car. It used to be that a home stereo was considered powerful if it had 100 watts (or is it amps?). Now car manufacturers are advertising systems with 350 watts (or amps). You could hear that in Maine!
Also, motorcycle noise was mentioned. As a motorcycle rider, I always had stock mufflers. When I lived in B'klyn and Charles Schumer was still in the NY legislature, he proposed a law that would ban motorcycles from driving on the street after 10 or 11 o'clock at night unless they could prove they were returning home. Instead of having the police go after bikes with no mufflers or loud mufflers, he wanted to penalize all motorcycle riders. I'm a life-long Democrat, but Schumer is still a jerk.
Love your show.
It is 9:30 pm Tuesday night in Stapleton. The neighbors are having an earth-shakingly grand time if the noise level is any indication. Unfortunately I would like to hear my own entertainment, but cannot over the radio's blasts-from-the-unfortunate-80's-past, the yelling of overly enbeered humans, and the 3 neglected dogs closed in their upstairs room.
BUT...Tomorrow is a holiday! Oh, Joy of Joys!!! That means the considerate guy on the corner with the Suzuki motorcycle is going to run up and down the 3-block-long street several times, setting off car alarms, inspiring choruses from the neighborhood K9 choir, and drowning out Mr. Softee.
Ahhhh..I still have half-a-dozen valium and 2 pair of ear-plugs. And I can go back to my Manhattan job on Thursday: it is quieter there. Maybe I'll make it through one more week.
Re: the racism issue...I live in a predominately Polish neighborhood. Polish hip-hop (yes, there is such a thing) being blasted from passing and parked vehicles (loud enough to set off car alarms) happens ALL THE TIME. You can't get much whiter than Polish hip-hop.
Enforcement is going to be along economic as well as racial lines. The guy constructing the condos in Williamsburg has a huge bankroll and lawyers who can sue the city in response to anything stopping work on his site. The guy playing bongos at 2am in a rent-stabilized apartment does not have the same resources. Which is louder to live near: a jack-hammer or a set of bongos? Guess who the cops are most likely to ticket.
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