wnyc.org / 93.9fm / am 820

ATRs are definitely not all incompetent. No one has brought up the issue of age discrimination. My school was phased out and many teachers founds jobs relatively quickly and others floundered unable to find jobs. Many of those who did not find jobs were typically older individuals.
A friend of mine is still an ATR three years after our school closed. Why? For two years after our school closed he could not find a job after going to multiple job fairs. He is an outstanding, fully certified, very professional MATH teacher. However, he is in his early sixties. So...last year he got a spot working at a junior high school, teaching seventh and eight grade. He taught 9th grade regents math to two of his classes, one 8th grade class and one 7th grade class. Every 8th grader he taught passed the NYS Regents exam, and all but two 7th graders passed as well. This man is amazing!!! Is he incompetent? According to Klein and Brill he is, because he is still an ATR at that school.

We have all these ATR teachers now because the entire evaluation process in the D.O.E. is corrupt and broken.

Look closely at schools receving an A. Are they really performing at an "A" level, or do they simply appear to through dishonest methods? Are their students hand picked, or do they represent the general population? When their jobs are at stake, the integrity of teachers and administrators goes out the window.

Teachers who refuse to pass along students who are not up to real world standards are considered failing teachers.

There is nothing wrong with the quality of students, it's the failure to fail undeserving students which is the root of the problem.

Who administers Regents exams? Very often, it's the same teachers who teach the students! Who grades them? The same teachers. Administrators will punish teachers who don't pass a lot of students. Unforunately, since all teachers are pressured to pass along their students, the students aren't up to the real world standard and they never will be.

It's human nature for principals and teachers to cave in where the livelihood is at stake. If the system was logical and just, it wouldn't be an issue.

Jack, I have to disagree with you about whether or not the UFT was involved in changing the funding scheme for paying teachers. A couple of years back, the UFT was part of a citywide coalition that was, among other things, opposed to this plan. But then the union caved when the DOE threw them a sop, left the coalition, and didn't say boo when the plan was put into place. I'm sorry I can't remember the details but I believe it was around the time that Klein wanted the right to place teachers at will.

Ms Medina naively seems to subscribe to the notion that interviewing skills are part of the problem in regard to ATRs finding positions. In making this statement, sadly she exhibits a clear and painful lack of understanding of the problem faced by an excessed teacher from a closing school who has over 10 years experience in the system. After many years of successful teaching experience, should a teachers’ career be based on interviewing skills or resume writing? Especially in situations where the principal conducting the interview might have very limited teaching experience. Wow!

Jack Israel

De Witt Clinton H.S.

UFT/AFT Delagate

The UFT has no role in changing the formula for paying teachers. How about having a person with teaching experience reporting on education for the NYT? Is that too much to ask?????

Every "ATR" works every day. If they don't have regular programs, they cover the classes of absent teachers. In my school, there is an ATR with a math license. Her salary is paid by the central D.O.E., because her old school had closed. The Administration knows she is an excellent teacher, and they gave her a program with very demanding classes. She has been doing an excellent job. But she remains an ATR. Why? Because if our Administration hires her into our faculty, her salary would come from our school's budget. See how it "works"?

In response to dbnyc in Bushwick: unfortunately, the union, in its attempts to be accomodationalist, acceded to this ATR scheme, but this is really the baby of the DOE. It was set up before they went to this school-based budgeting system, where staffing comes out of the school's budget, unlike before, when staffing was paid for by the central DOE. So the lion's share of the blame should not go to the union. Prior to this system, people who were excessed got jobs and worked in other schools. This monster was created at the behest of the DOE so that principals would have more "control" over their schools, but not one teacher in the ATR asked to be put there and doesn't want to work!

"they don't get hired because of their job-hunting skills"#7
This was one of her "brilliant statements" which triggered my response. Total zombiism.

Correction--forgot the "d" in "experienced" in previous comment.

At the end of this segment, when Brian asks Jennifer Medina whether principals have a disincentive to hire experienced teachers (i.e. most of the ones on the ATR) because they're more highly paid, Jennifer Medina reveals her bias on this issue. Instead of arguing yes or no, she goes back to that old chestnut of "they don't get hired because of their job-hunting skills". She insults the intelligence of teachers and the show's audience when she harps again on that old refrain of, "Well, the DOE have offered to help them fix their resumes and polish up their interviewing skills, but very few teachers have taken them up on this offer".

Of course they haven't taken up the offer, because, as Brian said, the problem is financial disincentives to hire them, and it would be a total waste of time to brush up one's interview skills because the real issue is not resumes and interviews, it is money. The principals simply have no reason to hire one experienced teacher when they can hire two neophytes for the same price.

I know this first had hand. (correction)

Mr. Klein created this ATR mess by closing schools randomly instead of trying to help them. I know this first had since I was a teacher at Walton H.S. which was closed even though our stats were good. When a high school takes on ESL and Special Education students, their stats suffer for various reasons. ESL students are wonderful; however they often take longer to graduate because they are still learning the language. Schools are judged by their 4 year graduation rate. In Walton’s case we were flooded with these students to the point of severe overcrowding and then instead of being praised for our efforts to help these kids, we were phased out. In place of Walton which was packed with 4,000 students are 5 mini schools with a total of 2,500 (or less) students. Why didn’t Walton ever get a chance to operate with fewer students? Ask Mr. Klein. Now that Klein has changed the funding formula to charge schools exact dollar amounts for teachers, it has created a disincentive to hire experienced teachers no matter how good they are if their schools are phased out

Jack Israel
De Witt Clinton H.S.
UFT/AFT Delagate

I heard a fragment of the segment and my blood is boiling. I think it's dishonest for NPR not to disclose the fact that NPR is a propaganda arm of American corporatocracy.
I have the following questions/comments
- is it possible that some of the teachers who are not working now, were forced our because .... they are not corporate zombies? I am not a teacher and know precious little about American pre-university education, except for the fact that it produces (and probably hires now) only corporate zombies. Several teachers I've met reinforce my firm belief. A historian working toward his Ph.D. was forced our for trying ... to teach history. A political scientist, working as a substitute teacher talks about "business centers" set up in inner city schools where students can't read, but are trained to worship Jack Welches and Bernard Madoffs. A teacher, a historian by training, recently retired (full and successful career) didn't know what Social Democracy is (and probably that Europe exists) after 25 years of teaching, when we talked some 10 years ago. What exactly was he teaching? A highly educated foreign born professional was recently forced out from CUNY (I know, I know, a different level) after she had been forced (together with her colleagues) to read "Who Moved my Cheese" and listen to "Team working, strategic planning, positivity/negativity, etc." Orwellian garbage.
Is it possible that principals (and their masters) prefer newly trained graduates because they have received the "correct" (Reagan/Rand?Friedman, love your boss and the rich ueber Alles) training and have no conscience.

It is unfair that the teachers in the ATR are being painted with a broad brush. Principals are refusing to interview these people. Many of the ATRs are too expensive. Many of these people are still there because of the negative connotations

where do unions get the idea that their workers have the right to be paid indefinitely to not work? this is the same nonsense GM had going with its union. it's ridiculous! and it is all at taxpayers expense. go look for work. if you can't get a job as a teacher then maybe you shouldn't be a teacher.

Please stop calling them acronyms. Acronyms are when you take the first letter (or letters) from a series of words and combine them to form aother word (e.g. laser, sonar, radar, etc.). When you just say the letters (e.g. MTA, PTA, etc.), they are initialisms.