wnyc.org / 93.9fm / am 820

Sarah P did not exactly say she agreed with Joe Biden on gay marriage. Biden indicated he supported full civil rights for same-sex couples (I suppose meaning civil unions but not marriage) and Sarah said she agreed that she did not support same-sex marriage. I didn't hear her say anything about supporting civil rights for same-sex couples joined in civil unions (or in marriages valid in the jurisdiction in which entered into, e.g. California, Massachusetts, Canada, etc.)

Andrea Bernstein: the Sarah Palin of journos. (In a good way, of course.)

I watched a different debate than the pundits. Insight and thoughtful critical analysis seem replaced by a new "fairness doctrine" where the media (sadly now including PBS) finds people to say exactly opposite things. Biden won because he had command of the facts. Palin won because she didn't say anything too remarkably stupid. This is neither news nor meaningful editorializing. It is a pathetic attempt to present a "balanced" analysis, that winds up being both morally and intellectually dishonest. ABC had a poll that found more than 80% of viewers believed Biden won the debate. Are 80% of viewers wrong?
Andrea Bernstein actually said that Palin won the debate because she spent more time looking directly into the camera. Others commented that Palin accomplished her mission of "no major gaffes," proving she is not a complete idiot. Only rarely do idiots get to be governors in this country. Palin is smart. But she is the worst kind of demagogue (witness her accusation that Obama is unqualified because he voted against an Iraq funding bill for "political reasons," when in fact McCain did exactly the same). And conveniently forgot that McCain--the great anti-lobbyist finance reformer--has a senior staff that is almost all lobbyists and was one of the Keating five. If I were her, I wouldn't want the country to look backward over the last 8 years either, b/c if you don't remember the past you are doomed to repeat it.

Gov. Pailin reminded us again of her experience as mayor, governor, business owner. The problem is that the job of VP does not require executive experience. As VP, her job is to support the Prez by facilitating passage of bills the Prez wants passed. She's proud of being a newcomer to Washington. But then how is she going to accompliah this if she knows nobody in Congress, nor has any experience as a legislator. Seems to me she's stating her qualifications for Chief Executive, not VP.

Pailin
+ mccAIN
__________
PAIN

To me the ultimate test is this: If I am confronted by an unpleasant person of a different race, gender, culture, age etc., does my mind go to those dark corners, exaggerating what it is that makes that individual different from me? It's much easier to clim the moral high ground when the person you are looking at is as appealing as Barack Obama. This doesn't mean you give people like Sarah Palin a pass. It means examining your gut reactions. As W famously said: "It's hard work." I'm sure most people don't want to bother

More on sexism. Here is where I feel good-intentioned people fail to find the inner racist and inner sexist. I always questioned why people were so much angrier with Hillary for her war vote than, say, Joe Biden. Judging from what he said last night, and what she said their reasons were identical. Why does her naked ambition bother people sooo much? It all seems out of proportion to me.

Why does the fact that Barack Obama has little experience on the national stage bother people so much more than the fact that John Edwards had the same amount exactly when he ran in 2004? I didn't hear that complaint back then. It makes one wonder... Of course, people then flood you with all the reasons they don't like a candidate; they start to sound like too much protesting. It's OK not to support a candidate for whatever reason, but I think people might benefit from a closer examination of their own reactions. The hysteria surrounding Sarah Palin seems to me to be symtomatic of the same virus. It's hard.

eva,
I remember that moment in the debate. It was the most genuine moment. I have always felt that sexism is a two-way street. My husband truly splits the child-care duties with me and because we are a bi-racial family, and because it is unusual to see the dad at the playground in the middle of the day he gets weird looks from people who probably think he's abducted the kids or something. For me, a true feminist is one who advocates control over one's destiny, whatever that may be. If it means being a mother who quits her job and raises 5 kids, so be it. If it means the same for a father, so be it. The reason we get into trouble talking about feminine and masculine qualities is because we all tend to assign greater value to one or the other. And it does not always mean the masculine is considered more valuable. Anyone who has raised boys and seen them through the public elementary school system is painfully aware of the "female" model that they are pounded into. Why are more boys than girls diagnosed with ADD? Maybe because their learning environment is hostile to them.

You are probably right. If the shoe had been on the other foot, people would have excoriated him.

#196,
That is real "energy."

Food for thought: Here's Roger Ebert with his utterly non-political, but I think well-considered, take on sexism:
"A very different sort of unanticipated moment took place during the debate. Biden said, "I know what it's like to be a single parent raising two children." He did not know if his sons would survive the auto accident that took his wife and daughter. For a moment, he lost his composure.... I believe, as I did at the time, that it was genuine emotion, and not stagecraft.

It could not have been anticipated by Palin. The next camera angle was above and behind her. She paused. The silence seemed to anticipate words of sympathy and identification from her. But Biden had ended in a sentence using the word "change," and her response, reflecting no emotion at all, cued off that word and became a talking point about McCain. This felt to me, at worst, insensitive and callous. At best, that she had not fully heard Biden. In either event, her response troubled me. If a man had responded in that way to such a statement from a women, he would be called a heartless brute."
When sexism can only be called one way, aren't we hypocrites?

O,
I'm going to try phone banking at my union as well. :-)

Eva and everyone,

don't even focus on McCain. Rent a copy of the Secret on DVD and look at Chapter 8. Elections are tipped in favor of the person all the attention is focused on. focus on Obama as President Obama, don't think about McCain.

Just focus on Obama and him being President. let's all get our energy focused on Obama as president.

Stay positive, think about a baby smiling and laughing to make yourselves feel better or flowers, whatever works for you. Stay positive and keep the positive energy on Obama and if you are religious or believe in a higher power, pray!

193,
no problem, I'm going to apotheosis a lunch run on the beach now...
:)
Good weekend all. And God help us if the McCain ticket wins.

mc,
I'm not slamming anyone for mispronouncing gerunds (and my point was really dropping the g, which I'm not sure is a mispronunciation, or just a correct pronunciation after you have literally changed the word to a more "folksy" version of it. That is, "aynt" is the correct pronunciation of "ain't".)
I'm simply pointing out that making your language more "folksy" is a tactic that's being employed here.
Obviously, when BHO did it, and when HRC did it, and when McCain occasionally does it (and he does it rarely) these are also people who have studied the issues and can hold a conversation - answering the questions put to you, specifically, not the answers you want to answer.
I'm almost sorry that we didn't see the Sarah Palin on the video in the alaska gov. race. She was competent, and forthright, and very respectable. Last night's performance was... something else. Like someone said, you want the women's vote, don't wink at their husbands from the tv set. It's not polite....

Eva, oops. I realize your tongue was in your cheek :)

Eva, #190: Not a lefty. Not a bigot (if you're referring to the affirmative action comment, FYI I am AA). Maybe intellectual, but never pseudo anything.

Name-calling. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

eva,
Re: mispronouncing gerunds, I feel compelled to gently point out that you used to slam HRC for the same thing. WNYC used to play fairly often as a promotion for its election coverage the following quote from BHO: "I don't wanna wake up in four years to find out we've been arguin' over the same things and not gittin' anything done."

Only to point out that these kinds of tics tend to be more irritating if they belong to someone you don't support, and either unnoticed or forgiven in someone you do support (you being the general "you" not you individually). That said: I don't care how they pronounce "nuclear," (Carter messes it up too, and he's a nuclear engineer), I don't care how many houses they own, I don't care how many kids they have or how much they look like me.

What have they done and what do they intend to do?

That should be enough to send anyone still on the fence to Obama-Biden IMHO, however, I recognize that others have different priorities.

#188,
per #185
You "pseudo-intellectual lefty bigot."

Hey Kelly LOL-try the Oxford American Dictionary, which not only sounds the word out in ONE form (noo-klee-ar) but also adds at the end of the definition: Do not pronounce nuclear noo-kyuu-lar. If you don't have one of these at home, you may also consult dictionary.com for an explanation of how this "psuedo-pronunciation" came to be.

Sara Palin's existence on the ticket and "performance" in the debate is the worst-case scenario of the distorted definition of affirmative action. I'm thinking about how I could have been McCain's running mate, limited to only topics that I know about -- animals, literature, alternative health, etc. -- whether they are related to questions or not. QUESTION: What are your thoughts about the current financial crisis? Has your analysis uncovered any cause-and-effect relationships? ANSWER: You betcha, Gwen, there are causes and effects in all relationships. As there are also in my own. It is often said that if ya love Faulkner, ya hate Hemingway, but doggone, what we really need is job creation for our pets and livestock. Especially Fannie, our cat, and Mae, our dog, our apotheosis.

Ahhh, that was fun. Blissful.

Kelly,
Independent of your partisan name-calling, I've also been wondering about the pronunciation of nuclear. I recall looking it up a few years ago, and it appeared that the "nu-cu-lar" had become an acceptable, if not preferred, alternative in the same way that any alternate pronunciation does - through constant usage.
My take at that time was that it was considered "acceptable" if not preferred.
Having watched Palin in the gubernatorial debates, it occurs to me that she probably once pronounced the word as "nu-clee-ar" but, as she forced her accent to become more "folksy" adopted the alternate pronunciation of the word.
We are, however, trying to elect someone who can not only appeal to the part of the population that favors dropping the g's on their gerunds, but someone who can communicate effectively with world leaders. In the same way that folksy Bushisms and Bush policies haven't served this country well, it is difficult to imagine how Sarah Palin would.

Gay Boy from West Village,
If you're still here -- how do you see Obama as denying gay people of their rights? Is it the opposition to gay marriage? Or his refusal to be photographed with Gavin Newsome?

Just curious.

Kelly from Park Slope,
It's quite clear you don't like Biden. Whom would you have liked to see on the ticket?

I have been listening to this station for many, many years, and I have never been as outraged as I was this morning. Has Andrea Bernstein taken loss of her senses? On this morning's broadcast, she actually defended Palin's MISPRONUNCIATION of the word "nuclear," again with the tired "NU-CU-LAR" as a REGIONALISM! Really??? Does that mean that George W. Bush is really from Alaska, or is Palin really a fake Texan??? Exactly what region does this come from???

Does this mean that we can all just make up our own pronunciations for words at random, and then claim, "well hell, that's how they say it back where I come from!" if someone questions us?

It seems that now even this station is lowering the bar for both the candidates and the public. We need to hold ourselves to higher standards, folks.

Brian,

I understand why you -- as a professional -- are appalled at Palin's explicit declaration that she was not going answer the moderator's question. It's funny, too.

But honestly, was that really such a bad thing? Candidates and elected officials have been ignoring questions for as long as I can remember and reporters and moderators have been letting them do it. Do you really prefer the game where they pretend to answer the question, but actually quickly pivot it into something else?

I prefer the honesty on this one. Perhaps it will push moderators and reporters to actually do their jobs -- instead of what Colbert described them as doing.

For example, at every press conference, when the guy up front ducks a question with some kind of pivot and calls on someone else, the next reporter should ALWAYS say, "I don't believe you answered the previous question. Let me ask it again for my colleague/competitor."

Never going to happen, right? Well, then, the why shouldn't the guy or gal up front just admit what they are doing?

It's unfortunate that Biden is getting crap for using the word "Bosniacs." It's a real word, but it doesn't sound like a real word. It means "Bosnian Muslim."

#157 Chuck from Brooklyn....

Biden is an old fart who flip flops at every possibility getting into the limelight...
or on TV w/FDR....or palgarizing Neil Kinnock...

McBiden is the same old, same old Senator Windbag, despite his botched Botox

Barf....

Samuel Augustus Maverick (July 23, 1803–September 2, 1870) was a Texas lawyer, politician, land baron and signer of the Texas Declaration of Independence. From his name comes the term "maverick", first cited in 1867, which means independent minded. Maverick was considered independent minded by his fellow ranchers because he refused to brand his cattle. In fact, Maverick's failure to brand his cattle had little to do with independent mindedness, but reflected his lack of interest in ranching. He is the grandfather of U.S. Congressman Maury Maverick, who coined the term "gobbledygook" (1944).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Augustus_Maverick

All this talk about change coming from Palin, one begins to wonder who the democratic vice-presidential candidate is. During the debate, as Palin repeated liberal rhetoric, I couldn't help but think, the only thing that Palin would be changing is John McCain's diaper.

While Palin's performance was folksy, it was strikingly devoid of substance. I feel she was totally out classed by Biden, regardless of where the expectations bar was set. Amidst all the 'goshes' and 'by-golleys', I'm left with the feeling that Obama has partnered with a seasoned statesman, whereas Mr. Mcain has apparently (and sadly) chosen a sidekick...

While Palin's performance was folksy, it was strikingly devoid of substance. I feel she was totally out classed by Biden, regardless of where the expectations bar was set. Amidst all the 'goshes' and 'by-golleys', I'm left with the feeling that Obama has partnered with a seasoned statesman, whereas Mr. Mcain has apparently (and sadly) chosen a sidekick..."

Sarah Palin, like George Bush, seems to appeal to people on the grounds of she being 'just like them', charming, folksy, using 'common sense' but no deep thinker. Someone interviewed on CNN after the debate yesterday, said she is a good fit for VP as she sees the world just like the common American. THAT exactly what is terrifying! The common American seems to know next to nothing about the world, except what the cable TV feeds him on Irak. The USA just had eight years of a President that knows little about the world and does not think he need know more; that uses 'common sense' without understanding the problems, running the economy to the ground, and believing God sent him on a mission. How can anyone think that Sarah Palin will be any different from Bush, and that McCain/Palin will change things??

I don't want authentic people as national leaders as much as I want intelligent, reasoned, knowledgeable politicians who recognize nuance and act with considered force.

On those merits, Palin is severely lacking and serves as an empty shoe. We need the foot for kicking.

#156 Seth from LI ---

your comment is rather unhinged if you think Brian is shilling for Palin....

Just because Brian doesn't worship at the Obiden altar...doesn't mean he is a paid lackie for anyone...

People who can't focus scare me.

[116] Martin Gabel
a quick google of 'transcrit debate palin' i would put up the link but for some reason it won't post but transcrits are easy to find

She is amazingly unqualified, stupid and sarcastic.

Winking, folksy...barf.

a reader on the times website put it best:

"if you want to appeal to women voters, don't wink at their husbands from the TV set."

I didn't get to watch, I only listened, but when I heard about the winking, I thought: HUH?????

It was Joe Biden who really appealed to women last night. He was thoughtful, sensitive, strong and INTELLIGENT. But especially thoughtful. The same qualities we'd want in any leader, regardless of gender.

martin 116
a quick google search 'transcrit debate palin'
gives the following web site http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/02/debate.transcript/

Joe Boring was a blovating white male Washington politician who thought he's running against Bush - no wonder he's never polled above 3% in anyh primary....

This balthering egomaniac should be put to pasture and perhaps get a job as a greeter at home Depot which he allegedly spends his free time at & can watch FDR on TV.

What a gaffe-prone phony.

I believe this is the best candidate:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ACP2XpfDlQ

AM I the only person in America who DOESNT FEEL SORRY FOR PEOULE WHO BOUGHT HOUSES THEY CAN'T AFFORD?

They SHOULD lose those houses. They CANT AFFORD THEM.

I am tired of blame being put onto lenders.

If someone hands you a gun, do you shoot yourself?

LETS GET REAL!

I missed the article title, author of the article on the SEC decision 4 years ago

Please post if you caught it. Not mentioned in the segment listings. Much appreciated.

Listening to that last clip, I have a bone to pick with Gwen Ifill. It is not "wonderful" that Biden & Palin agree in their opposition to gay marriage.

Time to get apathetic about this election again, because like alex said this is now another lesser of two evils because they have very similar stands of the issues that i care about.

Im not choosing or over the other based on technicalities.

I don't want to have a beer with Sarah Palin or go moose hunting with her.

I'm sick and tired of hearing Palin refer to herself as a hockey mom. What in the world does that have to do with being qualified to be VP?

Palin needs to stop the nonsense and do a live interview on Meet the Press, Face the Nation, This Week, and Late Edition.

How about when she said,"There you go again, Joe, talking about the past..." when the QUESTION was what the failures of the past administration was. She clearly just shuffled through the deck finding whichever point she was thoroughly coached on was closest to the question (when she felt like it). We've seen the disastrous results from a President who clearly couldn't think strongly for himself; he just became a conduit for Cheney, Rumsfeld et al since they knew he was too lightweight to challenge them. While noone could possibly do the job without a lot of advisers, one would hope for the life experience and judgement necessary to sort through everything.

She couldn't name a single Supreme Court decision or even current events reading material. She is so obviously not ready for Washington. She may think it's an advantage not to be from Washington, but that's exactly who she'll need to work with not even understanding the basic terminology or processes.

I dont
want her to be soo comfortable... she doesnt come across as confident,
polished, and smart.... and my thing is... if people thought about what
would happen if she was VP and something happened to McCain... can you
imagine her running the country?.... absolutely NOT.... I would NOT want
her to be president. It felt like she was a robot last night and she was
reading from a script... She kept going back to the same points... and she
kept trying to use the whole "Im a mom" thing... Biden was so much smarter
than her and his answers had depth... Shes a joke.

I am very disappointed as a Gay American, that a African American running for president can so easily deny civil rights to Gay people!!

The signal to conservatives, as I saw it, regarding Sarah Palin's remarks about gay marriage, is that she referred to the "choices" that people make in their personal relationships. The idea that being gay is a choice - that it is behavioral - has been employed to work against the security of civil rights for same-sex couples. I believe, from what I've read, that Palin has been consistent in describing gayness as a choice - maybe she should have a little talk with her dear, very dear friend.

Why has it become acceptable to put down the "East coast" as S. Palin did last night? What if Biden had dissed the "West coast". How would the right spin that?

Very simple: They both sucked!!!

Another classic example of a lesser of two evils debate

I was disturbed by how Palin went in and out of her folksy linguistic style. When she was most focused on her subject matter she spoke quickly and didn't drop her "g"s, then she'd make a clear switch in tone to her charming, small town self, and speak more slowly, seemingly deliberately drop her "g"s and insert those incredibly annoying "doggone it"s. Did anyone else get the feeling that her folksy style was a self conscious act?

I felt that Biden was the stronger debater - he addressed issues and did best when he wasn't simply throwing numbers at people, but speaking with a bit of emotion and passion - Palin was one the most manipulative candidate I have heard on TV - she dodges articulating her appalling positions by spouting patriotic rhetoric and using her looks, gender, special needs child and every other possible tool to gain sympathy - none of which can disguise her naked ruthless ambition as she has already acknowledged she would be king. why is her infant child on TV every night instead of being in bed? or is it more opportune to bring him out on display instead to get a sympathy vote? this is really shameless and thoughtless behavior towards her own child.

The other appalling thing about the debate was that the 2 things the candidates agreed on were gay marriage and Israel - this is VERY thin moral ground to stand on for any thinking human being... how can anyone condone heterosexist or zionist supremacy? Of all the issues we face, why are narrow minded, unbalanced, fear based positions the thing that brings them both together?

Not to mention, "drill baby drill??????????" We are not five year olds with no capacity to comprehend the future and the consequenses of our actions. I feel the American people deserve better than someone like Palin.

Re: Comment #27

Was that supposed to be snide? I, for one, cringed a bit when I heard "Bosniak" because I wasn't familiar with the term and to my ears it sounded like a Bushism, which would've been bad coming from the Democratic side. So, I thank Peter from Flatbush for pointing out that Biden was correct.

Significant lack of substance aside, I think where Palin failed last night is her inability to connect emotionally with voters. Just go back and watch the clip re: meeting parents at the soccer field who are afraid about the economy. She is almost smiling when she delivers that line. I didn’t detect a note of concern in her demeanor. Yes, we are afraid and we want to know you feel that we are afraid. Don’t just throw some talking point at us. Every line she delivered was of the same tone: borderline cheerfulness. Nobody is feeling cheerful right now. Ironically enough, Biden, the man, conveyed sincere concern in his delivery. I felt it and I think others did too.

Brian,

You and Andrea are being way too easy on Gwen Ifill. She completely dropped the ball. Which served Ms. Palin quite nicely. Blaming in on the format, or the campaigns or the weather just sounds like whining to me. She didn't even try to keep Ms Palin on point. That's not anyone's fault but her own.

Despite the tight format, Biden missed an opportunity to respond to Palin stating that she was for women's rights as part of a laundry list she was going down re her accomplishments. Women's rights indeed. Making rape victims pay for their rape kits, denying women the right to choose whether or not they want to continue a pregnancy. This woman is no advocate of women's rights.

Al, Bosniacs is actually the right term for Bosnian muslims. Look it up.

@105 Matthew

I agree.

It is sad that the Democrats have fielded a first term Senator with 143 days in the Senate for the highest office in the land. Even worse, he chose a tired old slickster -- I've lost count how many times he has run for Pres./VP -- as his running mate.

Unbelievable!

...particularly, given that the head of the ticket has no legislative or legal accomplishments of note! only a couple of -- premature? -- autobiographies!

Welcome to the United States of Dumb.

She did NOT say she had gay friends! She said she had friends who differed from her on gay rights... she left it to us to infer that she has gay friends by the way she worded it.

I think her chilly response when asked whether she was saying she supported gay rights and she simply answered the original question posed to Biden was disturbing.

I thought Senator Biden was the "winner" of the debate, however I was prepared to dislike Sarah Palin and was surprised. I thought she handled herself extremely well, she was well spoken, attractive and I agree with the caller who said she will not go away after the election. In defense of her, she was sincere and intelligent.

I really liked Joe Biden's comments at the end when he stated "McCain is not a maverick" and gave examples.

I'm voting for Obama but I think they're being too hard on Sarah Palin because she's a woman!

It is tragic that there is no one to hold the press accountable for handing legitimacy to an unqualified candidate, which is exactly what occurred after the debate and continues this morning.

whoa i guess i lot of people watched the debate last night?

Both Biden and Palin, just spewed talking points. No one was straight forward and direct and talked about the issues.

I can't stand that this v.p.'s need to talk at the American public like they need to be spoon fed. stop talking to me like i am an idiot!!

If the economy is going to the toilet just let me know without all this hoops.

I think when Palin mentioned her "dear friends who disagree" she meant ANTI-gay friends... she comes from a pretty conservative evangelical background. Maybe worth another listen...

The last call was funny!!!!!

Oh and thanks for your 'tolerance' on gay rights, Governor Palin, but no thanks, your disgusting attitude is just pathetic!

Brian, I'm surprised at you. Palin refusing to answer questions is NOT the same as Biden saying he is going to give straight answers to Obama, with opinions that might differ. It's an example of the false equivalence that other MSM assert repeatedly (ie, McCain's lies are just more of what all politicans do, so it's a wash), but you generally do not. I count on you to make the meaningful distinctions of real analysis.

The two major policy points for me were Palin insisting on maintaining and possibly EXPANDING the power of the VP and her utter inabiity to even understand the questions about foreign policy. It's astounding that any editors would think she did well when she gave a mostly content-free, literally winking, song and dance routine.

Did anyone pick up on Palin professing "tolerance" for same-sex couples? Doesn't tolerance imply that same-sex couples are a bad thing, but she is willing to "tolerate" it?

it's funny how brian and andrea give Palin credit for having actually thought out positions and on things like the VP and Constitution and Civil Unions...she doesn't know what she's talking about at all! she doesn't really have positions other than what has happened in Alaska and being "pro life".

OK, the first time was funny, but now the I ask my question you answer your question, is not. Enough

Dennis Kucinich, who was a Democratic candidate for President, sponsored a bill that would amend US immigration law to treat same-sex partnerships the same as heterosexual partnerships.

Mark--

All I see from Palin is smooth, used car saleswoman patter... no content whatsoever.

As for people trying to convince themselves of what they already believe? Well, I thought that McCain won the last debate. And I believe that Biden wiped the floor with Palin. So at least I am not trying to convince myself of anything.

80 percent approval rating or not, she is not ready for the big leagues.

I don't think anyone "won."

However, the clear loser is the media. Ms. Palin's performance makes the less-informed undecided voters inclined to believe the Right's bogus claims of her being booby-trapped by the "media elites."

She performed--she did not inform.

I was dissappointed w/Ms. Iffil's moderation--or lack there of. She just served up the questions. Her biggest gaffe was not following up on Palin's views regarding the office of the Vice President. What about the Constitution?

Biden looked and sounded like he was on his first date with a hot chick, and he was blowing it.

All the people criticizing her for using the wrong general's name in Afghanistan, they would not have noticed it unless the "let's-get-Sarah" haters brought it up. Biden's equivocating, backtracking and rambling wasn’t criticized.

By the way, Sarah was winking at me. She's going to be our prettiest VP ever.

Forget misspellings,bad pronunciations (although I loved that she kept saying "nucelar"), forget the winks, smiles and smirks!!! What about no knowledge on any of the issues, no specific answers, no specific plans for our future!!! I am appalled that the entire media is focusing on her "behavior, instead of her lack o experience and intelligence about the real world we are in living in!

As a woman, I am embarrassed that she is being portraited as "representing" our gender, and we women are supposed to "cheer her on! COME ON!!. I got really upset when Geraldine Ferraro said:" I wanted her to do well for my grandchildren!!!

The Republicans chose Sarah Palin because she says 'nucular' and 'Eye-raq.' They think that Obama and Biden come off as elitist smartpants. Palin, like George Bush before her, is supposed to appeal to what Palin referred to last night as 'Joe Six-Pack.' It reflects the truly elitist attitudes of the Republicans toward working class Americans.

Tangentially, I remain amazed that no one challenges Gov. Palin on her repeated statement that she is the energy expert. The extent of her expertise is a single year on the Alaska Oil and Gas Commission, where she was the public representative on the three-member commission (with a geologist and a petroleum engineer) and conversations with her husband. While she might have some knowledge about oil drilling along the Northern Slope of Alaska, she has next to no knowledge about the petroleum distribution system within the United States or worldwide and no experience in alternative fuels. Despite teh claim of expertise, no one has ever asked her to qualify the statement. There are literally thousands of people with greater knowledge of the energy industry than the governor.

The height of hypocrisy a Black man denying gay people their civil rights!!!

I disagree. I believe Joe Biden did address his Yes vote in support of the war resolution. He voted for the bill to provide Bush the leverage with the UN. With 2 minutes to answer, Joe Biden did well not to get mired in the trap of this truthful yet difficult to communicate point of view.
In addition, I tip my hat to Biden for not once condescending to an opponent who clearly does not know anything about the legislative procedure.
Just having someone like Sarah Palin on that stage vying for the office of Vice President against Joe Biden is disgusting and tragic.

AL from Manhattan - look at post #9

<-- Pats self on back

WHO WON OR LOST ???
THIS IS NOT FOOTBALL !!!!!
( AND I AM A SPORTS FAN )
ALSO UNTIL WE SIMPLIFY OUR LEGISLATIVE PROCESS
BY RESTRICTING BILLS TO BE ONLY ABOUT 1 SUBJECT WE ARE GOING TO BE UNABLE TO STOP THIS NONSENSE ABOUT WHO VOTED FOR OR AGAINST WHAT WHEN ETC --- NO EARMARKS UNRELATED AMMENDMENTS
1 THING AT A TIME !!!
VOTE UP OR DOWN !!!
( THOUGH REALISTICALLY POLITICIANS WILL
NEVER DO THIS BECAUSE THEY MIGHT BE SUBJECT TO CULPABILITY AND SOMETIMES GIVE CREDIT TO THE OPPOSITION )

It may be a Candidian thought, but as I seriously tried to watch Palin with less negative judgment, it seemed like a lot of her folkiness was forced. Especially the quick switches from a slim substantive comment into the smile and wink. That is the sort of thing that the base seemed to love, and they're onboard, but doesn't seem enough to me to pull in the undecideds.

I'm an old-style student.

No matter how much I watch the videos or listen to people's "opinions"...

I NEED A TRANSCRIPT TO NOTATE AND READ AT MY OWN PACE!

Why is it such torture, and often-times impossible, to get a "hard copy" of these "debates" so that I can have a proper document to review and use for cross-referencing?

How do I thoroughly review the validity of the statements made by the candidates.

You can inderview 1,000 "experts" and get 1,000 judgements.

Someone (NY Times, WNYC, NPR, ...) get on the stick please.

On another note:
I still very-much appreciate your show.

thank you.

MG

[[MG. There is a link to a transcript (and a neat annotated transcript video tool) on the front page of the NYT website.
http://elections.nytimes.com/2008/president/debates/vice-presidential-debate.html]]

Why does Sarah Palin get free reign to compare what she is able to do with Alaska Government to what she will seek to do with US and apply to States? No other state has oil company income to subsides the State coffers and, as a result, avoid the hard issues the rest of us face.

I will be convinced Sarah Palin is a serious canidate & not a joke, when shs has a press conference! Not a debate where she has index cards to consult before answering! NEXT a press conference please!!!

When will we wake up - Palin a success???? Why because she is cute and bubbly. How will that play in a national crisis? I was not at all happy with the waste of my time that were her non answers to most of the questions asked. Biden on the other hand, was prepared, informed and responsive to the questions posed.
My biggest disappointment was with Ifel. Not one question about women's issues or the healthcare of children in the USA. What debate???

Linda's comment: "2) I was struck, from a semantics point of view, at Palin's frequent use of the word "also," where the word absolutely wasn't needed. It suggests that she was getting through the debate simply by stringing ideas together, with little ability to reason through them..."

gets at the thing that struck me the most about Palin's strategy. She started every answer a little unsteady as she searched for the words to move from the question asked to the speech she had memorized. As soon as she bridged that gap, she took a breath, slowed down, looked directly at the camera and smoothly talked through what clearly seemed to be a memorized talking point - which generally was only slightly (if at all) related to the question. And this is what everyone today hails as her showing her savvy debating skills and clearly being able to hold her own. To me, holding your own is being able to come up with a thoughtful answer on the spot - one that addresses the question. Not presenting predetermined answers, no matter what the question is.

I would like to hear a discussion as to how you would think the reaction would be if Biden was a woman and Palin was a man. Meaning, if a man had given Palin's type of performance and the interviews she's given, would he be so coddled? I find the gentle treatment of her quite sexist.

Palin's answer were a never ending loop or soundbites, talking points and complete nonsense!!! She spoke in inconherent run on sentences and had one point to sell -- she did some work with energy in Alaska. Did she look like a future VP a resounding NO!!! Even with all her prep I just dont think she has the intellectual capacity to perform at that level. Pls watch the debate again..her never asnwered the question (probably because she didnt understand them) and point blank didnt make sense 90% of the time!!!.....

andddd who dah he double hockey sticks are ya winkin at eh?

my kids u betcha!

Do you really want your next vp to sound like this?

I too was very frustrated that Gwen Ifil did not ask enough follow up questions. I felt like, as moderator it was her job to question or clarify some of the statements that she made -for instants the role of the VP. I watch the debate feeling very truly frustrated when Palin talked around questions. I left the debate not learning anything new about this Palin, other than she can speak well - or perform well.

Once again -- the soft bigoty of low expectations. And the analysis is mostly a total disconnect from what really happened. Sarah P was never going to fall flat on her face -- she is clearly someone who can spout any number of words with confidence. The question is -- did she say anything. The answer is -- mostly not. She basically repeated her talking points, she added her own brand of folksy interjections. But she never really responded to the question -- and then set her own ground rules. Joe B didn't say anything that could be called a gaffe -- which seems to be almost anything he says that someone thinks he shouldn't have said. If you want a perky gal who can BS with a smile and wink -- then she's definitely vice presidential material. Give me a break.

Anyone up for a wager on whether Palin will give any more interviews (aside from to Fox news) between now and November 4?

BRIAN, I think you are in love with Sarah Palin

You just said "she did so well last night"

BRIAN! She is a disaster. Why dont you get past your crush on her and start to do your job as a journalist, and analyze content.

As an American, I'm embarrassed that Palin is in this position. The candidates for the Pres and VP are to be the cream of the crop of potential leaders of this great nation.

I'm afraid that American Idol does a much better job at "vetting" their contestants. Sure there are the "blundering" fools in the beginning auditions, but at least the person standing at the end can actually carry a tune.

So she got through it without melting down. What will the McCain camp do now? Will they keep her sequestered, or put her in front of the press corp? Either way, it's a no win situation for McCain, and reflects his poor judgment.

Ohhh the "Achille's Heel" moment. My jaw was hanging; I was also in a bar in Brooklyn and I remember saying halfway through Palin's answer: "She doesn't know what an Achille's Heel is."

She really doesn't know.

When Sarah Palin repeated that "the constitution is good," did no one remember that the only piece of literature on her desk in a posed photo while she was on the Wasilla City Council was a document from the John Birch Society regarding a new "constitutional convention" ?

CBS, CNN showed polled the debate watchers instant preferences were clearly with BIDEN.

All of this pundit analysis is just spin.

Of course Ifill was "chilled," that was the point of all the Repub. talk about bias. They're very, very good at that and have scared most of the media.

Sure Mark...and her "Road to nowhere"??? very successful

I am not comfortable with her as VP with mccain up next at the "jump off"!

Putting this debate in context, since it's all about undecided voters at this point, and since that pool is getting smaller and smaller, and seemingly in Obama's favor, the stakes for the dems are also getting smaller and smaller, while at the same time, they are getting larger and larger for McCain. So in that light, Biden was terrific, because accomplished things on two levels – on the overall "fitness for the office" level (which is not very important anymore), he clearly trounced her, and on the "who's going to get those last few undecided voters level", he gave a credible alternative to the "hockey-mom" appeal of Palin for those types out there in that other America, and they are out there.

Why isn't anyone mentioning the "Bosniacs?" Are they related to the "Animaniacs?"

A propos Andrea and "ten dollar words," did Palin understand what an "Achilles heel" is? Her answer simply praised herself rather than point to potential weaknesses-- whereas Biden's response re the Supreme Court was very clever... but he didn't follow up.

Al #77--

Did you watch the Couric interviews?! I'm sorry...but Tina Fey was unable to look as lost or foolish as Palin was by herself in those interviews.

Congratulations to Glenn Ifill who, despite criticism by certain rebublicans, did a yeoman's job at moderating.

Talk about sexism - how much more can the pundits possibly lower the standards for Sarah Palin. No gaffs does not translate to a qualified vice presidential candidate. As the front page of Slate.com says "so she spoke in complete sentences but she still doesn't know anything about foreign policy".
She was completely scripted and didn't answer questions directly - the Couric performance was no anomaly- that is the real Palin.

Brian

Gwen Iffil didn't ask any questions that would have allowed Palin to distinguish herself from Biden.

No abortion question; no 2nd Amendment, read GUN, question...

that was a big help to Biden.

Jesse Califano: 'The unspoken word- written'!

Joe Biden showed himself to be the double-talking political hack that he actually is!
There is a reason tht he is a two-time loser in his political 'career' <-(using this word loosly)!!

It is THIS CONTRAST that allows Governor Palen (yes- she IS the Governor of an American State!) to absolutely shine!

The whole debate was MOCKERY of a debate.

Palin didnt answer anything; just blabbed on in Newspeak

Ifel didnt hold Palin to actually ANSWERING anything

Biden was the only SINCERE thing about the debate.

BRIAN, do you have a crush on Sarah? "She only got it wrong by a little bit...?!?!?"

Joe Biden was very kind, a true gentleman for not CRUSHING her. He didn't even call her out for the mcclellan mispronounciation, clearly he could have.

Indeed, Caribou Barbie proved that she can give a memorized speech very well, and look cute doing it. The dilemma facing America is: How can the campaign process be brought to a point where the smartest and best people become our leaders, instead of electing our "best buddies."

I think most of the people posting here are convincing themselves of something they already believe.

Sarah Palin has an 80% approval rating as Governor as Alaska; she's a bona-fide, successful politician. She may not have Joe Biden's smooth, used-car-salesman gift of gab but what she does have is a record of success.

Brian,

I really appreciated Biden's comment at the end of the debate where he reclaimed the right of men to be primary care takers. As a woman it is offensive to me that Palin uses her life experience of being a mother as the ultimate trump card. His comment reminded the American public that he is multi-dimensional

Also, I found it gross Palin used a flirty and sex approach to express her womanhood in a forum where she needs to come off as a leader -grounded and ready to make hard decisions. In my mind, a mother who thinks of her family first (or in this case her country first) is not worried if she can capture the attention of the men in the room.

Andrea, when you comment that voters "don't know where Obama stands", do you ever think that this is just code for people who are too racist to vote for him?

And no matter how many speeches Obama gives and information that is out there, they keep using this excuse as cover for the big question -- are you willing to vote for a black man?

I think we all knew that professional sound byte programmers could teach her to answer a list of possible questions. As it turned out, they taught her 5 answers and told her to recite those answers in spite of the question asked. This is meeting expectations? I can recite the ingredients from the Per Se cookbook. Would you let me cater your wedding? I can see a courthouse from my window, would you let me file motions in your death penalty case?
Sarah Palin has shown an ability to robotically regurgitate GOP talking points. That's great. She'd make an adequate press secretary. But does anyone really think she's qualified to be a 72 year old tortured cancer survivor's heartbeat away from the presidency?
To wit. As a mayor and a governor blah blah blah. Maverick. Blah blah blah. Washington outsider. Blah blah. Iraq. Blah blah. Middle class. Blah blah blah wink. My family. Blah blah blah. Maverick. Blah smile blah.
Fortunately, we'll never see her asked an unscripted question again...EVER. Her appearances will be limited to Rotary Club functions, Wal-Mart openings, and Fox News propaganda.

I agree with your caller Phyllis!

I think Palin did fine (because expectations were so low). But not sure she helped McCain's case. So is she (with the Republican operatives) setting herself up for 2012? She's clearly the new face of the party, a woman, young. And the GOP desperately needs that.

Gwen was horrible.

They could have replaced her with a flashing light to let Biden and Palin know that the time was up. The light bulb would have asked better follow up questions as well.

And regardless of the format, Ifell could have pointed out that the questions were asked to be answered not to be avoided.

Andrea: Please, less armchair psychology and more discussion of the policy substance. I can muse abut what taps into the American mindset as well as you can. But none of us really knows, right? So stick to what they candidates said, or didn't, about what they plan to do.

"Not as dumb as we thought" does not a victory or vice president make.

I agree with a caller who said that she was like a wind up doll. She would answer for 3 seconds and then turn towards camera a recite all the key words over and over "American people" "corruption" "greed" "our freedoms" etc. Karl Rove would be so proud.

What amazes me more than how low the bar was set is that everyone thought Palin would flub. The format of a debate is nothing like an interview format. The interview with Katie Couric was one on one, face to face. Katie could turn the spot light on her and push her for more details if/when Palin skirted a question. The effect was a deer in headlights. Other than some side comments about not really answering the question, there is really no follow up in a debate and, as Palin said herself, she could choose the topic if she wasn't interested in answering the question asked.

Do we Really need another person in the white house who can not pronounce Nuclear?

Details of Sarah Palin's policies? Sarah Palin has no detailed policies. All she did was recite generalities and well-rehearsed talking points. No policies.

For all the people complaining about the Sarah Palin's low expectations, blame SNL and Tina Fey. Republicans are the ones laughing now.

Brian,
re: the US Commander in Afghanistan. It's not only that she twice confused his name, it's that she got the FACTS wrong. Don't you think that's worth mentioning. The General clearly states in the NYT article that the "surge" concept will NOT work in Afghanistan.

I'm a male. And I think Palin was wooden and the media is way too sycophantic with her.

THE NAMES DO NOT MATTER!!!!!!!! WE HAVE THEM WRITTEN DOWN SO IF WE NEED THEM WE HAVE THEM!!! IT'S THE ISSUES PEOPLE!!!!!

http://dispatchesfromthejazzunit.blogspot.com/2008/10/freedom-from-choice-sort-of.html

Palin mastered talking points and bumper sticker slogans. She hasn't mastered an understanding of the issues. She's a rank amateur politician who's way in over her head.

No Andrea, no gender gap here! All Female right here and I agree with the guys!

Ya Brian this woman (Phyllis) talking is right on....do not cozy up to palin just cause you like her dancing act

Joe Biden was debating a script last night. Questions were posed to Palin and when there wasn't an appropriate response in the script she return to old and unrelated talking points. Palin's winking and "you betcha" speak is insulting to voters with half a brain.

OMG did Brian just say she only got it wrong by a littl!!!! Jeez

I have been listening to commentary on the debate last night, and I am dumbfounded. Was anyone else watching the same debate as I was? Palin showed herself to be incapable of providing an answer to nearly every question she was asked. While Biden provided a straightforward response to most of the questions, Palin answered nearly every one with stammering, generic rhetoric.

There is something really wrong with this country if Gov Palin is considered to be a qualified applicant for this office.

I don't understand how anyone could say they don't understand Obama's positions on the issues. After how many months of debates and speeches and all the newspaper coverage? Anyone interested in Obama's positions could go to his website and read them, by the dozens.

I think we saw a very well trained Palin puppet last night. Thank god for note cards. I think the fear in her eyes of repeating the bobbles in her recent interviews showed through her eyes, and that in and of itself proves to me she is not qualified for the job.

Palin had 3 personalities throughout the debate

1. That annoying bully hockey mom
2. The nervous personality a la Couric fumbles
3. The scripted robot where at moments I thought her arms would start doing a robot dance.

She constantly contradicted herself on the issue of less government in people's lives but yet say her and McFailing here going to bring government and people together, mixed message?

This country does not need a good old average american that's "just like you" that's exactly how Bush sold himself. The issues this country faces are much too complex for someone that has only had 5 weeks of Washington experience. This may be a stretch but for those Palin supports who are naive enough to buy her spiel take a deep look at groucho marx's saying "I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member." :-)

Towards the end, Palin commented about how her role as mother and her connecting with regular people prepared her for the Vice Presidency. In response, Biden made some comment to the effect that he resented the implication that as a father he didn't have the same life experiences. What was that all about? I heard her comments as being about her. He seemed to have heard them as an attack on him.

Robert from Man....Ya this was clearly a case of a bar being set really low and not having to do much to succeed (but not win). The pundits are salivating over what was a 45 minute campaign speech...You think we'll see her again? They may keep her out of the spotlight (at least talking situations)...she did her job and whick her away

Why accept the categories and expectations of the Republican spinners? So what if Palin was not as bad as she was on CBS news - she was still glib, vague, and buffoonish. She acted not like a national leader but like a host of "Hee-Haw." Biden wiped the floor with her by presenting a dignified persona and answering questions with seriousness and detail.

From WashingtonMonthly.com (if you go to the site there are links to all the comments - there are more than 1500 characters allow:

"THE MEASURE OF MENDACITY.... At one point in last night's debate, towards the end, Sarah Palin insisted that Joe Biden "supported John McCain's military strategies pretty adamantly until this race and you had opposed very adamantly Barack Obama's military strategy." This, of course, is ridiculous, and Josh Marshall labeled it "her biggest whopper."

To be sure, it's right up there on the list, but was it her biggest whopper? That's hard to say; there are so many to choose from."

How utterly sad that the whole point of the Vice Presidential debate was whether the candidates would meet expectations. This is a serious contest about serious issues when our country's future hangs in the balance.

I'm disappointed that Ifill did not persist in asking Sarah Palin to answer the question asked.

At times the political handlers go overboard when controlling their candidates. Biden seemed too careful and restrained in his responses to Pallin's remarks. He could have challenged her limited experience or questioned her lack of knowledge of foreign affairs without seeming to attack her. By keeping his attacks solely on McCain, he was a gentleman but failed to point up Pallin's weaknesses. Did anyone else notice that Pallin didn't understand Ifill's question about her "Achilles heel?" She didn't seem to know what it meant.

I couldn't believe the commentators afterwords either. Was anybody watching the same thing I was? She didn't answer a single question. Had no explanation of policy plans, or specific ideas. She had 5 talking points and inserted when applicable. She winked at the audience, you betcha. Very unprofessional. Is she going to do that in a speech at the UN? She didn't know how many troops we have in Iraq, or the general's name in Afganistan. She didn't even read the constitution (at least the part about the VP). Doesn't she know what comprise each branch of government? And tax cutter? My ass. Alaska does not have a sales or income tax. What the hell does she have to cut? How on earth could Geraldine Ferraro state she thought Palin was qualified for VP. Is there a standard that should be upholded? If she can't answer a question directly at a debate, which is kind of the point, how can she be able to engage other dignitaries in any informed and competent way. Who calls themselves a maverick ever 10 minutes. Isn't that a little self congratulatory. Now, I'm going to go around and tell people I'm the smartest person of the world. I just don't see how people can take her seriously. I had elementary school teachers with more self awareness.

it's sad that brian can only address the radical insanity of palin's "i'll answer what i want" statement as a joke. imagine if biden had said that? wow.

http://dispatchesfromthejazzunit.blogspot.com/2008/10/freedom-from-choice-sort-of.html

Watching the VP debate, it occurred to me that for those voters who, for whatever reason, say they feel "uncomfortable" with Obama, that Biden is the only person on either ticket who looks, talks and acts like the kind of candidate people are used to. Do you think that could sway some voters who say they are undecided but on policy would be closer to the Democrats?

Did Sarah Palin know what the phrase "Achilles' Heel" meant?

Re: windfall taxes - Alaska has a different "ownership" structure where the state is owned in some way by the residents. The windfall tax is less a tax than the owners getting a bit more from their land. I don't know how it is set up exactly, but it isn't a tax.

How appalling that our expectations are so low that anyone could judge her appearance as a success. Underlying her question-dodging is a level of snarkiness that will be unleashed full-force should she ever (heaven forbid) be VP. bi-partisanship will be out the window sooner than she can say "hello, my name is Bridget to Nowhere".

I'm confused, why is the media not harder on Sarah Palin? The way she speaks and acts on stage is unprofessional. I don't think the winks and the "can I call ya Joe" and the "gosh darn" tone is appropriate. She is a candidate for the vice presidency, not the PTA. This all reminds me of one of those cheesy movies like Legally Blonde, where someone who is feisty and inexperienced turns around and wins over the system b/c of their "straight forward" talk. Sarah Palin said it best herself, that she is removed from Washington, I say so far removed that she has no right to be VP, and it only underscores the bad judgement of John McCain.

Garbage.

Her performance was good as a performance... she was engaging and yes, pretty, almost charming.

But actually listening to what she said? My goodness, what an empty vessel she is. Her answers show that she knows very little about pretty much anything. Constitution. Foreign affairs. Economics. All either canned responses from the talking points she had on the desk in front of her, or wandering dodges of the question.

But really, we should not be blaming McCain for choosing her. She is what America wants. Folksy. Down home. Not too knowledgeable and boring. And so, a brilliant choice.

When we as a people are more demanding of our leaders we will get better. But for now, Americans-- especially Republicans, based upon the presidential candidates they have chosen since 1999-- want ignorant buffoons who are or can simulate down home folksy values.

When do we become the Brazil of North America? I'm putting together a pool.

CORRECTION

ALASKANS HAVE BEEN GETTING THAT OIL CASH FOR DECADES.

SOME PEOPLE MOVE THERE FOR IT.

Jesse Califano: 'The unspoken word- written'!

Is the Brian Lehrer 'show' actually considered 'journalism' by any intelligent person in America with more than a high school education?

Bernstein: 'Katie Couric did a great job...'?
How stupid is this comment?!

There is a difference between a journalistic interview- and an crude interrogation!

Brian- MCLELLAN ISN'T MCKIERNAN, which is worse than mispronouncing.

The moment where Biden choked up about raising his kids felt like the only authentic moment of the evening to me.

I'm glad Biden also went after the Maverick title. I feel like I am watching Top Gun!

Three debate comments:

1) Gwen Eifel overdid it being on good behavior.

2) I was struck, from a semantics point of view, at Palin's frequent use of the word "also," where the word absolutely wasn't needed. It suggests that she was getting through the debate simply by stringing ideas together, with little ability to reason through them. She paraded information, rather than analyze it or see how ideas are connected. As Brian says, she was coached to dance around subjects, not assess them.

3) On several occasions, Palin did her best to suggest that Biden's views really were closer to her & McCain's. He deidn't jump to the bait.

not only did she mispronounce names she is another republican that cannot pronounce NUCLEAR!!!

I'm seeing all this praise for Palin... did we see the same debate? She wasn't a wreck, but lets be honest.. she didn't impress. She came across like a rookie Sales Person... sticking to the sales pitch, and dishing out the same retoric. I found so many of her answers to be fluff... no substance.. and confusing. I am an undecided republican, and I gotta tell you.. after seeing her handle that debate, I'm doubting John Mccain's decision making. I think she's tallented and has potential.. but no where near ready to be Vice President. So McCain's first big decision is to pick a running mate that is not qualified to be Vice President.

Shucks, now, guys: doncha think our Sarah was darn good, the way she was handlin' those Washington insiders? Wink, wink. . . Doncha love the way she was braggin' about her energy?

I found th "if you must take the presidency" most disturbing in that Palin said she'd take her own course, being a "team of mavericks."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0KFOwshkpA

Palin was able to skate by with lame answers because of the idiotic time constraints - 90 second answers over the course of 90 minutes.

Ifill didn't have enough time to redirect Palin to answer the questions she evaded.

Joe from Brooklyn couldn't be more right:

"She didn't mispronounce anyones name!....my god and you are the political expert!"

The standard for the 2nd most powerful position in the free world is PRONUNCIATION?!

The media needs to start doing its job again and raise the standard of discourse and expectation.

I watched the debate in a bar in Brooklyn. It was crowded with folks watching the debate together.

There were lines of Palin's that made the crowd laugh. In light of the upcoming comedic writers coming on as guests---it was a defense mechanism to laugh at G.W.B. In a way, that placated the population, allowing the horrors of his administration to go on. We felt helpless.

I like to laugh, but outrage is sometimes a more appropriate response. I don't want to laugh through a Palin Vice Presidency.

To people who say Sarah Palin succeeded last night ... what is the standard ... not breaking down and crying??????? Unless one's standards are that low, the substance (or lack of it) of what she said was appalling.

The fact that she actually could string words together for the full debate (nearly all of which were clearly spoonfed to her by handlers) may keep the race from becoming an absolute debacle for McCain, at least for now, but in surviving the evening Palin did nothing to alter the feeling that she is not qualified to be vice president (or president). She also did nothing to reassure the country that McCain is equipped ... or even inclined ... to reverse the policies that have made the current administration such a disaster.

(note ... I am a different Robert from Manhattan)

Katie Couric had trouble keeping a straight face during her interviews with Palin. If you watch Couric's mouth during the interviews, you'll see she makes little frowns as she listens to Palin's gibberish.

Anyone who gives Palin credit for her debate performance is being way too kind.

Biden lured Palin into one logical trap after the other.He schooled her. At the end of the debate, she had unwittingly supported civil rights for gays, showed her lust for Cheney's power pants, and suggested that McCain should "leave," quickly corrected by "lead." For anyone with the critical ability to read between the lines, the debate was a harbinger for an administration that would make Bush look introspective.

SHE WANTS MORE POWER THE CHENEY....STOP HER!!

Anyone think the VP needs more power? This abuse of power dreck has to stop.

I think the whole debate was crystallized in a single question that Gwen asked both candidates toward the end of the debate.

She referred to each of their perceived Achilles' heels: Palin her inexperience and Biden his lack of discipline and then asked each one what they consider to be their actual Achilles' heels. Sort of a hokey, job interview type of question, I know, but one that could allow them to show their humanity.

Palin answered first and her answer to me indicated that she didn't understand the question. She blathered on about "gettin' things done, bein' a maverick", etc. Biden knew that she didn't understand or answer Gwen's question and slyly referred to that in the beginning of his answer, but didn't point that out directly, because of course that would be seen as a personal attack and belittling to Palin, which would play right into her hand.

As always, if you're actually paying attention, to the people, the policies and what's actually happening to our country, the choice is easy.

Palin showed that she's a quick study.

But this more generally on the debate, between Biden and Palin last night but between the two camps in general: why is the Iraqi contribution to the (provisional) success of the surge never invoked? As I understand it, it is the combination of the Awakening groups, and the Sadr ceasefire that has actually brought about a reduction in violence, something fundamentally tied to the transfer of responsibility for ending violence from the occupation to the country itself. As with so much of the debate points on either side, the argument is stripped of its complexity, and never mind the old historical narrative of American Exceptionalism transformed into America the Global Liberator here. Isn't understanding the interaction between nations (not between the "good" and the "evil"), the complex interactions that create our actual reality (viz. the global spread of our credit crisis), what it would really mean to go beyond partisanship?

It looks like Palin passed the white knuckle test, but she did not pass the bar for being qualified to be VP or P. Many of her answers were gibberish, though not as bad as Couric, and she simply did not answer many questions.

Since when are the candidates allowed to choose which topics to answer? Sarah Palin repeatedly reverted to the energy topic. Why did Gwen not steer her to the question asked? I expected more of Gwen Ifil. We NEEDED more of Gwen. I think she was cowed by the threats of her own conflicts of interest.

Sarah Palin was great. She may not be as articulate as Joe Biden but she was far more down-to-earth, more sensible on the issues discussed, and far more honest.

Though I am most likely voting for Obama, I do like McCain. I don't agree with most of Palin's positions on social issues but most of those key issues were not discussed last night.

Joe Biden on the other hand is a total hack and a phony. I wish that Barack could have chosen someone who wasn't an entrenched Washington insider. I would have liked to see Barack pick someone like Mike Bloomberg. Oh well.

Gwen Ifil was a real let down, not getting answers to her questions.

The folksy thing is just too much.

And the winking thing was weird.

Her closing was just incoherent.

Welcome to the United States of Dumb.

Really, this was just more rhetoric from a bunch liars. However, despite not answering any questions, you have to be out of your mind to think that Palin in any way, shape, or form won this debate. My favorite part was when Biden schooled her on the fact that the vice presidential powers are not meant to be extended by consitution. How does that not scare people, that she'd really want to give more authority to the VP a la Cheney.

The gay marriage debate made no sense. It was pure semantics. It was a shame to hear it, and that the everyone plays right into this whole ridiculous denunciation.

But worst of all was foreign policy on both ends. More fear. But when Palin says she is learning foreign policy via Kissinger, that's the scariest thing of all. Biden knows more and may have a willingness actual diplomacy, but he's strong proponent of nation building (which has been proven to work--chuckle) Have fun voting.

I am actually now thinking of getting myself a pitbull. They seem very easy to train.

With the economy the way it is, I don't think her cutesy routine is going to impress anyone. "I've been at this for gosh 5 weeks" - hmmm, you've only thought beyond Alaska for 5 weeks, that's what you're telling us. Lame lame choice.

I guess we'll find out how much America likes getting lied to right in the face with such a cynical smile and a friendly wink. It is really gross to campaign in a way that counts on the voters being stupid or uninformed, and pumping out half-truths to keep them that way.

She could memorize lines and not screw up once!
So many in the media have been congratualing her as though she did good in an high school play. So what. She is still embarrassingly unprepared to be (god forbid) president of the US.

Sick of the folksy, I am okie from skokie attitude facade from her and the war stories from mccain.

she was off topic most of the time and thought she had the right to refuse/evade the questions asked by the moderator.

she tried to stay on energy where she is comfortable just like mccain sticks to the war, prisoner of war montage.

Andrea Bernstein,
Sarah Palin did mispronounce Gen. David McKiernan's name. She called him Gen. McClellan.

She also said he did not say a surge would work in Afghanistan, although he did say that.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/01/AR2008100100789.html?hpid=sec-world

Palin was obviously just reciting the talking points that her handlers had conditioned her with, so similar to the way that George Bush has been handled. I'm sorry that I listened to the interview on the radio rather than watch it on television; it seems that the wink was the defining moment.

Leo - My google acumen couldn't help McCain get a better grip on facts. Its because facts work against him.

Gwen Ifill did a terrible job as a moderator.

She refused to hold Palin to answering the questions asked.

Was she afraid of being accused of being an Obama supporter if she acted as a moderator?

ok if we agree that she made herself look competent, she still did nothing for mccain!

Brian,
Hilarious!
Too funny how you started your show today. Right on!
Thanks

She didn't mispronounce anyones name!....my god and you are the political expert!

Palin is a walking talking mccain robot, spouting buzz words and catch phrases!

Peter from Flatbush- Glad to see that you are a resourceful person - You are able to use The Google. You should go work for the McCain campaign to help them decreaese their level of incompetence

Should the moderator have asked Palin to respond to the questions? What's the protocol here?

Swoonie...u are crazy! ;) Vote 3rd party

McCain's handlers won't allow Palin to give any more media interviews. From now until Election Day, they'll limit her appearances to rallies in the reddest of the red states.

Despite her rootin' tootin' tomboy persona, Palin is too much of a coward to face questions from the media.

Apparently, the fact that Palin was not a total train wreck by the end of the night makes her supporters shout “victory”! The fact that Biden gave good, thorough answers “as expected” is frustratingly overlooked. It’s an unbelievable double standard. I suppose they’ll be REALLY impressed if she actually ANSWERS a question the next time she’s interviewed. Our political standards have become painfully low. It’s embarrassing.

Re: Brian's opening comment

It's quite amazing what photographs do not capture. Do you know what happened to the chinese protester with the shopping bag in Tiananmen Sqaure 19 years ago? After the famous photo was taken, he climbed on the tank, and then got in.

What was that about? Who was this guy? Was he actually just a soldier late for work?

Don't you wish that you knew?

I under Sarah Palin's folksy and friendly veneer I detected a hard layer of disdain and nastiness. I don't think she will help change the nasty partisan bickering in Washington should she get there.

Palin is EXCELLENT at parroting the Republican Talking points without any sense of reality!.

She did a great job of answering her own questions...

Is there some debate rule that says the moderator cannot say "Thank you for that information, but the question was xyz. Would you like to answer that for us?"

This was a 90 minute marketing opportunity for Sarah Palin. Joe Biden took it, no question. He was thoughtful, well informed, responsive to the questions and intelligent.

And that wink almost made me fall off the couch in disbelief!

Palin performed brilliantly given her relative newness on the national stage.

She came across as what she is: A young female politician with enormous potential -- an authentic person.

in the flirting with millions contest, call me crazy, but palin's eyes won out over biden's winning smile...

FYI - before someone mentions this:
Bosniak is the correct term for Bosnian Muslim.

Just pointing it out, because I thought it was a gaff untill I used the google.

ms palin raised robotic spontaneity to superhuman levels not seen since the tic-tac-toe playing chicken they used to have in the glass box in chinatown.

Newsday: "Palin recaptures the magic"

Washington Post: "Palin digs herself out"

New York Daily News: "Sarah Palin holds her own against Joe Biden"

Watching Washington (NPR): "What Sarah Palin did seem to prove is that she's qualified to be a vice presidential candidate."

******

Really? Have our expectations become so low that a candidate for public office need only smile, wink and act folksy so as to charm middle America?

Her answers were rarely relavant to the question at hand; she merely repeated talking points. And she didn't even do that well. She still rambled (slightly less than in the Couric interviews, but they were rambling nonetheless). The non sequiturs and phrases like "you betcha" and "doggone it" made me think I was watching Tina Fey on stage.

If our expectations are so low, it's no wonder that public discourse continues to descend to a level of absurdity.

Thanks for your live commentary on-line last night. It made the debate much more fun.

Two questions:
what was up with the wink?

Palin claimed that it is contradictory to call for change and point fingers backwards (if that's physically possible). If you have no understanding of how we got where we are, how are we to believe that someone claiming to not be a "washington insider" isn't repackaging the same garbage? haven't we been here before? you betcha we have.

I predict that biased Lehrer & Bernstein will go into damage control for Biden. They will ignore all of Biden's factual gaffes and attack Palin as they do frequently. Biden is a perfect example of why people hate Wash DC politicians. He votes for the war resolution, aggresively defends it's validity then midstream changes his position during the battle. Talk about stabbing the troops in the back! How can anybody trust Obama/Biden they will say anything to get elected even if they contradict themselves doing so!

Who won the debate? Apparently those who want or need to make the stretch are telling us that Palin succeeded by not performing miserably. Can we really afford to set such a low standard for our leaders?

Separate this debate from all of the hoopla, examine it on its own and what you have is a poor showing by a candidate for VP. It's that simple. All you have to do is read the transcript...

http://elections.nytimes.com/2008/president/debates/transcripts/vice-presidential-debate.html

I was a annoyed with the discussions after the debate. Clearly Biden was much more informed, and better all around. They lowered expectations so much that as long as Sarah Palin didn’t have a major blunder she came out with a positive review. Come on, don’t we have higher standards than that? She didn’t even answer the foreign affairs questions. Whenever she got stuck she just went back to a scripted campaign speech. She was so casual with her, “You know”s and “Man,” and “Gee wiz.” If it had been a job interview I would think she wasn’t taking it seriously. Is she going to talk that way to foreign diplomats? Don't we need someone in the White House who can pronounce the word, "Nuclear." She's worse than Bush. We need to repair our reputation in the world, not damage it further.

The CPD created a CLIFF NOTES debate schedule -2 90-min presidential debates with questions by Celebrity Journalists,1 townhall debate, 1 90-min vp debate with questions by a Celebrity Journalist
Every listener and commenter should contact CPD
Commission on Presidential Debates
1200 New Hampshire Avenue, NW
Box 445
Washington, DC 20036
and demand an UNCUT, UNABRIDGED, FULL-LENGTH debate schedule for 2012

We need 8 or 9 single issue debates running 3 hrs each where presidential candidates get questioned by panels of think tank scholars and print reporters who are experts on economics, foreign policy, energy, healthcare, etc
Same for VP candidates – 3 or 4 single issue 3 hr debates with questions from expert panels

As celebrity journalists, Lehrer, Schieffer, and Ifill have a superficial, wafer thin understanding of the issues. They need to step aside and make way for the experts.

Trying to cram everything into 4 90-minute debates is like trying to pour 15 lbs of sand into a 3 lb bag

Joe Biden won the debate hands down. Palin isn’t ready to play baseball at the major league level. She needs a few more seasons of Class A ball with the Wasilla Polar Bears before she earns a tryout from the NY Yankees.

Palin’s answers were as light as helium and as insubstantial as cotton candy. She’s unqualified to be VP and unprepared to become Prez if McCain were unable to serve out his term. McCain disgraced the Constitution and his military service by choosing Palin as his running mate and owes the nation an apology.

McCain put his ego first and his country last when he selected Palin.
Palin lacks the mental horsepower required to be VP.