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This I Don't Believe

Thursday, November 20, 2008

Atheism may be morphing from a personal issue to a political one. Annie Laurie Gaylor, Co-President of the Freedom From Religion Foundation, and Ken Bronstein, President of New York City Atheists, take a look at the nonbeliever movement.

Guests:

Ken Bronstein and Annie Laurie Gaylor

Comments [26]

Yvette from NYC

Why does it take so long for shows to play from th archives? Outrageous.

I've met Mr. Bronstein at the tabling events at NYC Atheists over at Time Warner Center. I am a proud atheist who grew up in the Bible Belt but who thankfully has left the invisible man in the sky myth behind. Reading Bertrand Russell's writing and Robert Ingersoll's changed my life.

Nov. 21 2008 08:56 AM
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Lilym from NJ

It's funny how many people (almost all) get very offended when I say that I don't believe in god. I came up with 2 answers that usually end further questioning:
1. If god made all of us, then he must have his reasons for making me an atheist.
2. I have bad luck, God is punishing me for not beleiving in him.

Nov. 20 2008 06:28 PM
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seth from Long Island

I look forward to the day when we elect a President and Vice President who are proud and unabashed atheists.

Nov. 20 2008 03:34 PM
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hjs from 11211

what would the founding fathers think about all this mixing of church and state.
thomas jefferson rewrote the bible without all the voodoo.

Nov. 20 2008 01:17 PM
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hustleandfloe from new york

Atheists, Agnostics, and Freethinkers would seem to cover all of humanity, if I have Freethinkers understood correctly, those drawing conclusions based on science and logic. So, while it may seem odd, belief in Jesus must be included in this group's discussion. It may be: I don't know. But, given the historicity and archaeological record of the bible, this is true. Now, that would be a real meeting if, in fact, atheists, agnostics, and freethinkers could start with the logic of their positions based on the evidence we have, and follow them to their truth conclusions - without hurling finger foods or epithets. This type of intellectual honesty would show Jesus as a documented figure whose claims, for that reason, must be taken seriously - for reasonable people either to accept or reject. I accept.

Nov. 20 2008 12:58 PM
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Phoebe from NJ

@20: Doh!

Nov. 20 2008 12:35 PM
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G.B. from Brooklyn

God is love.
If you love being an atheist, God has lead you there.
Have a great day.

Nov. 20 2008 11:21 AM
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Bill from New York

Also the debates over gay marriage are so rooted in notions of the "sanctity" of the institution that one wonders why, given the First Amendment, it's a political issue at all. Married in a church? The State shouldn't care. You can have your marriage; the State wants to know if you've filled out the right forms establishing your domestic partnership or civil union and that's all. That's equal and civil rights. Broaden domestic partnership to gays and take all talk of "marriage" out of politics and into the churches, mosques, synagogues, and witchy Wicca groves where you may or may not suppose it to belong.

Nov. 20 2008 11:20 AM
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Jean from Brooklyn

On the topic of the unofficial religious test to get into the White House, I think the thing that was most discouraging to me to about this election and the dialogue that surrounded it rarely discussed explicitly because both candidates expressed their "faith" adamantly.

I was impressed with Colin Powell for finally saying on Meet the Press what many of my friends had been discussing. With so much conversation about is he or is he not a Muslim, Powell said, "Well, the correct answer is that, 'No, he's not a Muslim.' But the REALLY RIGHT answer is, "So what if he is?"

The underlying assumption was that he wasn't a real American, that being a Muslim isn't being a real American. Which has terrifying implications for individuals like me who have been involved from an early age in politics, volunteerism, and activism and yet don't believe in any god or gods. Perhaps I should give up my citizenship now?

Nov. 20 2008 11:13 AM
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Bill from New York

Site was screwy (ghost in this machine?!). Double, possible triple post. Sorry.

Nov. 20 2008 11:09 AM
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Bill from New York

I'm smart enough to be humble enough not to presume to name the nebulous "something" beyond my understanding (which may well be the limit of my understanding itself) to be some kind of agent power or god.

Also, people need to get over this strange reluctance to call themselves atheists. I don't believe in unicorns, but that's not a belief analogous to religion. My non-belief in unicorns isn't a dogma I'd hold to in the face of evidence to the contrary. For reasonable people agnosticism isn't a diplomatic middle ground, rather it goes without saying.

Nov. 20 2008 11:07 AM
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Brad from NYC

Separation of church and state is a complete farce in this country. "In God We Trust" has no place on our currency, God Bless American should be sung in church, not at the ball park and I shouldn't have to acknowledge someones else's God to pledge my allegiance to America.

Nov. 20 2008 11:05 AM
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peter from manhatten

i agree the segment was way to short.

Nov. 20 2008 11:04 AM
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Daniel McCullough from NJ

That's it?

You have, finally, a segment on atheism all you give it is 8 minutes? Was it even that long?

WNYC is among those that marginalize atheists. Today's slight is just the most recent example.

Do a better job, please!

Dan

Nov. 20 2008 11:02 AM
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ROB from Springfield NJ

Your segment today on atheist was WAY, WAY, WAY too short. Next time please devote more time to this issue. Thank you.

Nov. 20 2008 11:02 AM
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isa kocher from kucukcekmece istanbul turkey

I applaud this program and I applaud this movement. I happen to be a devout believer, but I hate the interference of religious dogmatists who interfere in politics and force their dogma on us.

William Penn made separation of church and state a fundamental guarantee of religious freedom.

There is no business of mixing the two. Every time they get mixed, religion loses.

I don't want anyone telling me what to believe. Keep your dogmatics to yourself. That isthe only way to believe. it is between you and yourself. All dogmatics is unreligious.

God or whateer doews not need our help. If you need gvernment to enforce your faith, then yu don't believe.

I am all for atheism. Right on Guys!

God is on your side.

Nov. 20 2008 11:01 AM
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david from NYC

I believe in a higher power, have always been raised to believe in god and I do, I do agree with this organization and we do have to fight this right wing of religious mongers that want other people to believe in what they belive in and are very extreme about it, and they use any measure to win political office and I think this is wrong look at the the extreme example of Lee Atwater and how he used religion and politics and the at age forty when he came down with a terminal illness then judge his actions and moral ways about how he lied and destroyed lives and careers when he questioned other politicians religion. And in the end was afraid of his after life because of what he did

Nov. 20 2008 11:01 AM
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Bill from New York

I'm smart enough to be humble enough not to presume to name the nebulous "something" beyond my understanding (which may well be the limit of my understanding itself) to be some kind of god.

Nov. 20 2008 11:01 AM
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inquisigal from Brooklyn

I do not call myself an atheist for the same reason I don't call myself a believer - I can't prove or disprove the existence of a higher power. However, I do look forward to the day when a self-proclaimed atheist takes public office. The implication by God-believers that anyone who does not "believe" is immoral and can't make good decisions is offensive. It's much more difficult to learn various points of view and to study facts in order to make "ethical" decisions, but I'd rather our leaders do just that.
God is not the default know-it-all.

Nov. 20 2008 10:59 AM
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Steve (the other one) from Manhattan

It's sad that you have to express a belief in an invisible man in the sky in order to hold public office in this country.

Nov. 20 2008 10:58 AM
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LeoinNYC from Soho

The damage that the right-wing organized religions of America are doing must be obvious after the passage of Prop 8 in California. To see the Mormon Church spending tens of millions of dollars to stop people who love each other from getting married at the same time as thousands of children die from preventable diseases around the world... It's really sick.

Nov. 20 2008 10:56 AM
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Bo from Brooklyn - Prospect Heights

Right on! I am so tired of religious mythology and superstition being inserted as an inviolable argument in civil discourse.

Your god is not my god. Get over it. Non-theism, agnostic, non-deist...whatever you call it, it should have equal standing. Reason over "supernatural."

A proud non-deist here.

Nov. 20 2008 10:54 AM
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Robert from NYC

Well Bill, it was Elizabeth Duhl, after all.

Nov. 20 2008 10:54 AM
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JJ from nyc

I am humble enough to believe in God, and smart enough to know that I cannot prove God’s existence.

Nov. 20 2008 10:53 AM
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Bill from New York

Wow. That was the dumbest ad I've ever heard.

Nov. 20 2008 10:49 AM
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Joan Hirsch from New York City

Tell your listeners: Here's what the Atheists, Agnostics & Freethinkers at NYU are doing tonight:

"Morality Without Gods: An Exchange"

Thursday, November 20, 6:45-9:00
New York University
Kimmel Room 914, 60 Washington Square South

* Is religion really harmful?

* What’s the difference between science and faith?

* Can people be good without “god”?

with

Massimo Pigliucci - Professor of Biology and Philosophy at SUNY - Stony Brook

Sunsara Taylor - writer for Revolution newspaper and a host on Equal Time for Freethought on WBAI-NY.

Paul Eckstein - Assistant Professor of Philosophy at Bergen Community College and a host on Equal Time for Freethought on WBAI-NY.

Moderated by:

Matthew LaClair - President of The Center for Inquiry on Campus and on the Board of Directors of Secular Student Alliance. Matthew came to national attention in September 2007 when the New York Times, the Los Angeles Times and Anderson Cooper reported on his attempts to stop his high school history teacher in Kearny, New Jersey from preaching his religious beliefs in class.

Sponsored by:

Atheists, Agnostics & Freethinkers at NYU
Equal Time for Freethought on WBAI-NY

for more information: www.equaltimeforfreethought.org
or call 201-486-3420

Nov. 20 2008 10:17 AM
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