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CARBON TAX CENTER: Check out www.carbontax.org. Loads of charts, links to articles, studies and analysis.

TAX SHIFT IMPROVES ECONOMY: Al Gore and many economists left (Rob Shapiro), center (Bill Nordhaus) right (Gren Mankiw and Ken Green) advocate a tax on carbon pollution (an economic "bad") to replace taxes on goods and services. In addition to reducing greenhouse gas emissions this "tax shift" would improve efficiency of the economy by reducing or eliminating taxes on work, saving and investment. It's a win-win!

The dividend approach Charles articulated would also be an economic boost as it would money into individuals' hands where it would provide a stimulus. For for most of us who aren't energy hogs the dividend would more than offset the effects of a carbon tax on consumer goods and energy prices. Another win-win!

We can have a healthy, growing economy AND start reducing carbon emissions! That's news!

(re hjs/57 I also think we are on the same page if what you mean is also referenced in the #2 posting above, second paragraph)

agree w these insights above -- a related thought -- it is said that a solution can be defined not by solving your problems but choosing them.

hjs,
Exactly.

superf88,
except that problems sometimes don't get solved because someone doesn't want them solved and not because there's no easy answer

superf88,
You're probably right, if anyone knew than maybe it would be solved. I have another theory, though, maybe someone does know but no one wants to hear it so it is politically toxic and won't go anywhere.

confusion factor --
May i recommend these 2 general overlays, you probably already do but it might be beneficial to employ them formally:

1. free market trumps govt. bodies (such as those ridiculous insta-carbon trading/pay to pollute markets, enforcement of which would make Homeland Security look like a one-man shop)

2. look around at what others are doing, ie other countries etc.

Those two filters eliminate over 37% of confusion on any subject big and small!

And now for the really big insight -- drum roll -- (in whisper) Nobody Knows! Think it through and your assertion is among the leading in the nation. (otherwise the problem would be solved. Right?)

hjs,
It would seem so. We can't just keep doing what we're doing. I'd like to see investment in renewable fuels and I would like the lower income population to not bear the brunt as they usually do.

Probably way too much to ask.

in that case, i guess either is better than nothing?

hjs,
Good luck. There is so much conflicting info out there I can't even begin to sort it out. I tend to give Al Gore more credit simply because he is not running and does not have to pander.

mc
i have no clue
when i get a minute i'll research

hjs,
As per #47, I am in a state of confusion in general. How about you?

mc
no i meant in general

It always strikes me as ironic that voters in America want the government to do more, but are so reluctant to pay the government the money it needs to do the very projects voters want completed. Unfunded mandates occur when the government hasn't got the money to fund said projects-and then we wind up with flops like No Child Left Behind and bridges falling apart in Minneapolis.

If we did away with taxation altogether, there'd be no money to fund the police, the army or the fire departments, most of whom are cash-strapped as it is. The problem itself is not taxation per se, but how the money is spent-if the money is being directed toward raising the salaries of elected officials, then it is being poorly spent. If it goes toward reducing the threat of global warming, cleaning up the air and water so we can breathe easier and our tap water won't be poisonous- then it's money well spent.

America, get over your fear of taxes, and watchdog the legislature to make sure what's being collected goes where it should.

I'm still confused about what effect a carbon tax versus cap-and-trade would have on innovation of new sources and on our day to day economic well-being. Anyone else?

Zach,
Talk to the folks in Astoria or Washington Heights about how reliable Con Ed is.

hjs #38,
If you were refering to #26, what I am saying is that people go on and on about coal as this great native natural resource (we have lots of it) and that we should be converting it to a cleaner burning fuel and them somehow put the carbon back into the ground. No one ever talks about what the land often looks like after the coal has been extracted. If you travel the states I mentioned it looks like some kind of holocaust hit there. We need to address the way we extract coal, not do strip mining and not kill miners with retreat mining techniques like they did in Utah.

The issue with the public schools was not air conditioning, but the fact many class rooms have bad ventilation and no fans. My daughter attends Art and Design on 57th street. 3 of 4 classes had no fans. Maybe New England Breeze attending mayor Bloomberg might also remember that those schools had no electronics heating the air or large buildings put up by his developer friends blocking ventilation

ConEd is great. They've never failed me (luckily) and I feel like I'm getting my money's worth when I pay my ConEd bill. I can't say the same about KeySpan.

It was so HOT that Hillary finally told Bill to stop breathing down her neck. Of course carbon is filthy, and tawes are a necessary obligation of a society in order to ensure it fulfills its needs to all of its members.

Why isn't there a separate "topic area" for the ConEd thing. I would love to hear what people have to say about this and the Queens outage in 2006.

Are failures for the ConEd network or just the supplier? I am registered to receive energy from another company but of course it is delivered by ConEd. Will this save me? I doubt it, but just curious... thanks!

Isn't it true the "grid" hasn't been really fixed since the 2003 black out?

mc
i didn't follow that whole thing. how do we feel about it?

It seems to me that taxing carbon at its source is the most direct method, with the fewest opportunities for windfall profits by insiders.

Just last week (I don't remember whether it was on your program) there was discussion of a company in India that was producing a product whose only use was to generate very potent greenhouse gases that would qualify the company for lucrative benefits when they were destroyed. If we allowed "cap and trade", we would be seeing that and more in the U.S.

Even if you increase the cost of carbon, the people will just pay more, and the atmosphere will continue to be polluted. We need to transition to a new source of energy!

Auctioning allowances to use a public resource? Sounds like FCC electromagnetic spectrum cautions, and I've yet to see a check from FOX, NBC, and Disney.

the idea that politicians will not (1) spend the tax revenue or (2) create exemptions is completely absurd.

Every time there has been any kind of strict limitation - Gramm Rudman (no spending beyond revenue), social security (payments not used for general revenue), etc. - it's been violated.

The idea that this purity could somehow be maintained is just ridiculous.

That was directed at 24.

28, I hope speculators like you go to jail for fraud. People like you are parasites who plague the rest of us.

Giving away carbon credits for free is exactly the problem with McCain's plan.

Listening to the carbon tax guy talk about what will have to be done to get a carbon tax that won't be riddled with loopholes makes me wonder what country he thinks he's in, and I'd kind of like to live in that one.

As a bicycle commuter, i think cap and trade would be great if individual people were allowed to sell their carbon reductions: 100,000,000 drive to work alone every day; half of them live within easy biking distance of their jobs. Let people who give up car commutes in favor of bikes, telecommuting, mass transit or car pooling sell warrants to people who still want to drive.

We got fed up waiting for an accreditation program and effective government policy and now purchase Emssion Offsets to achieve a zero footprint . We contacted both Al Gore and the B&M Gates foundation for support for an independent accreditation program because only with this will the enormous demand by the public to achieve individual zero footprints be deliverable in the face of business pressure on government(s) slowing/preventing effective policy implementation

The simple reason for any system is attributing full cost to the consumption of carbon. Everyone across the value chain from production and consumption should be responsible for every cost associated with carbon, which includes sequestering or pollution costs. A tax or cap and trade are beginning to address this underlying issue.

But sooner or later companies will get sick of having to buy carbon credits or get hit with hefty penalties, and they'll pursue better alternatives.

samir,
Before we go whole hog on using "clean" coal we need to examine the way it is extracted. If you have ever been in eastern OH, western WV or northeastern KY you can see where whole mountains have been deforested, removed and the slag dumped into nearby streams and valleys, a technique that the Bush administration is hoping to codify as an executive order before it exits the White House.

How difficult will it be to enforce these cap and trade permits?

carbon trading -- great idea!

as a speculator I will be sure to form an energy company so that I can be awarded carbon credits, so that I can sell them.

Free markets really do rule!

Why not go further and say that revenues from carbon taxes etc. should be invested in developing renewable energy sources such as solar, wind etc?

A strict cap and trade system can be effective. It will definitely encourage better practices provided that the system is tough and not weakly enforced.

Who's going to (or maybe the question should be, "who should") invest in research to dig us out of this fossil fuel hole we're digging ourselves into? Taxes and/or cap-and-trade isn't going to replenish our disappearing energy sources.

I'm confused. If we return the money we collect from the carbon tax to the people, how will the price signal change their behavior?

kathie
i heard about the impeachment, it's a go no where stunt. history will judge the bushes, those who voted for him, and our nation.

On the setting of the level of a carbon tax:

* We can't fix the carbon problem without solving the coal problem

* We know how much it costs to decarbonize coal power via carbon capture and storage

* If we let cap&trade markets set the carbon price, we will either hit a safety valve or the price will be kept low by early low hanging fruit, and we won't get these types of technologies deployed for decarbonizing coal power

... that is, I meant to say, polluters will put the entities that *produce* carbon dioxide in poor communities ...

(sic) 100 mp gallon. Sorry. Yes, it did exist.

The places that the polluters will *put* the "capped" carbon dioxide will invariably be in poor communities--where they are nearly invariably put now. Leading to higher levels of asthma and other respiratory diseases among those who are already hurt the most in our society.

Why can not revenue from carbon tax be returned per capita and increase at rate of a penny per gallon for ever?
Then it would not disrupt the economy and it would make planing for the future more necessary.

You MUST EARN 200,000 OR MORE per year to be TAXED (call it that-TAX is not a bad word, if it's fairly distributed).
Taxing the average Joe for something he/she has never had any role or control in is patently unfair. We are continually being manipulated by big money, i.e., carbon trading. Sheesh, we had
a car back in 1960 that got 100 mph, but, it was stolen back to Pontiac who'd mistakenly let it to sale.

by the way, the revenue will be wasted just like the majority of every tax dollar that leaves your paycheck. it will not suddenly be put into a 'lock box' (LOL) for alternative energy. lets get real here.

Carbon Tax. I say hell no.

I'm getting tired of hearing how taxing peoples income and thereby reducing there standard of living is some type of boon to everyone. It's a ridiculous talking point.

A carbon tax *CAN* work, and better than a market that can be manipulated. But we have to stop calling it a carbon TAX. Rename it to something

(think "estate tax" -> "death tax")

s

Politicians.

Hi Katie,
I hear stupid left wing media, which Leonard will be talking about today dismissing Kucinich as a near Marxist. Absurd. That said, he's too left to be Obama's VP. Obama is way too cautious for that. Biden has a better chance with foreign policy cred.

Carbon tax will help encourage companies to stop emiting carbon. The revenue should be invested in cleaner energy which is having a hard time being competitive.

Katie,
You should email the show and ask them to cover it.

Thanks, mc.

That is something to definately bring public awareness to.

Kucinich, I couldn't get the spelling right, that was who I meant, I think he or Bidden has a good shot of being VP.

On the carbon thing, carbon is dirtier for the environment and we need more taxes to fill our deficit. Raise the taxes on the wealthy, stop the reverse Robin Hood and give back to the middles class to help our economy. We the People can take steps to reduce carbon emissions and explore alternative energy sources but we need more taxes. Need cash flow to make the engine run.

Katie,
It was not a senator at all. Articles of impeachment are brought forward in the House. It was Congressman Kucinich of my home state of Ohio.

hjs,

did you hear about the 35 articles of impeachment against Bush presented yesterday before Congress? I forget which Senator it was, Kussinic or Sanders?

Brian Leher moderators, please cover a segment on this impeachment newspiece!

Won't a carbon tax or carbon trading scheme line politicians and the so called markets up against those trying to invent a carbon free energy source, or proliferate existing ones (like sunshine)?

Many resent the powers that forced cars to replace public transit a century ago as our normal means of transport. Establishing an infrastructure of Taxes or carbon trading smacks of smart people selfishly setting up walls against innovation.

taxes can be invested back into our nation, and will help pay for the endless war